Torquay United Fans Forum

I have touched on the importance of the 'off field state' of the club in previous threads (I can't remember which ones!) and, as mentioned by others, without the Bristow's money it would have been game over a long time ago as there are others in the Plainmoor top end who have contributed very little in the way of monetary backing and even less in leadership and man management (with some notable exceptions I should add). The problems on the pitch are there for all to see and as I haven't watched United play a match for months I can't add anything to that subject. What I can do though is tell you what will soon, if it hasn't already started, happen behind the scenes at a club that is threatened with relegation out of the Football League. I worked at the club when it happened the first time and it begins a long way out from the actual relegation on the pitch. Personally, I had little choice but to stay at my post and take whatever came (in my case a new board who kept both myself and Kerry on even with some of the usual back stabbing from some quarters) but it very quickly becomes a scene of rats jumping off a sinking ship. People are understandably looking at their short term future and see employment elsewhere as the way to go and who can blame them. What this generates is an apathetic attitude as people who know they won't be around the following season are not going to bust a gut to go down with the ship. This can extend to the players as well as loanees see their return to their parent club on the horizon and those out of contract are many phone calls down the line to pitching up somewhere else come July's preseason training.

Back at the ranch there will be heated conversations on what the future could bring and what direction the club should be steered in. Give the board some credit in that they can see full well what might happen this season and just because publicly there is no obvious communication it is folly to think that many eventualities are not being weighed up. If relegation is avoided it may well happen too late in the season for many of the staff at the club to change their plans so either way next summer may well be one of huge change at Plainmoor and, beating the drum again, the only true constant are you guys, the supporters. There are one or two people at Plainmoor living the dream and are not fit for purpose and as long as they are allowed to do this then off the pitch little will improve regardless of who the manager is and how the team performs.

kevgull wrote:Plastic pitches or Improved performances?

Artificial pitch every time. Improved performances are a short term thing, eventually they will stop, maybe next month, next season, whenever. I would only sack the manager if his relationship with the players has gone tits up and consequently performances are affecting the attendances. If the players and management are as one but the results are not great then I would back the manager 100%.
If a club is in a position to invest in other income streams away from 23 Saturday's of the year then, in my opinion, they are doing the correct thing rather than spending fortunes hiring and firing managers of pretty much similar ability i.e. they have some form of success at one club and fail at another. That is lower league management.

wodger of awabia wrote: Yes, but what about,

3 Position in the League table.
4 Customer satisfaction & Match Day experience
5 Ability to attract new investment ( would you consider TUFC a good investment at the moment? )
6 The already substantial investment in better facilities ( new stand & training ground ) which will not be required in the Conference
7 The in-fighting at Board room level ( to sack or not to sack ) which has probably already started.

A good post and I will try and answer your questions!

3 - This will be a direct result, eventually, of point 1 (I'm not saying it has already happened though!)
4 - If a team is near the top of the league and flying customer satisfaction and match day experience becomes less of an issue, especially in the boardroom, (trust me, I have witnessed this first hand), although I accept that is important to a great many people.
5 - Clearly a team at the bottom of the Football League won't stand out as an obvious investment choice but again point 1 will indirectly influence this as the team's performance will potentially attract new support and sponsorship etc.
6 - Will Plainmoor ever be full in League 2? Very, very rarely and the investment has been done and you are not going to knock it all done simply because of a relegation.
7 - I couldn't comment but anyone pro the manager on the board will have to start thinking seriously when the gate receipts start falling away.

Just as an aside: An artificial pitch, while costing a fortune to begin with would make a massive difference to lower league clubs' potential revenue streams.....

Any football club director, owner or chairperson worth their salt, no matter how big or small the club, should take note of two particular factors: 1-The relationship between the playing squad and the management & 2-The attendances at home games. Once the first one has broken down and the second one is going down it's time to iron the 'mutual consent' trousers (I'm not suggesting either has happened at Plainmoor!).

diamondgirl wrote:So, Darryl, are you saying that, as supporters of Torquay United FC, we have bigger (Financial?) things to worry about, regarding our club, than the fact that we are bottom of the whole football league? Are you suggesting that our perilous posision is, in fact, the least of our worries?

Sorry, not having a go, just reading between the lines of post that you have submitted.

That's a fair question but please don't read too much between the lines. Obviously, when I worked at the club and, even more obviously, after I left I was rightly not privy to the inner financial situation of the club. I was though working at Plainmoor during the Chris Roberts era and I can categorically state that I doubt that level of financial suicide will ever be repeated at Plainmoor again!
In my original post I wanted to just stress that although emotions are running high for many, the long term future can be secured regardless even if a drop to the Skrill happens. I have seen it asked on other posts around this forum about the business acumen of the directors, well some of them are more than capable of handling a business such as TUFC and I'm sure plans are in place for a promotion, stay where you are or a relegation, whatever occurs. Believe me, there are many football clubs operating in a higher Football League position who are in a far more perilous financial situation than Torquay United and I refer you back to the 'duck on the water' scenario in my earlier post!
I certainly don't mean to sound like a glass half empty kind of person but there are probably 92 other professional football clubs within the pyramid who have bigger attendances and bigger income streams than those at Plaimoor and while that should not mean a perennial struggle it sure means a lot of hard work and a little bit of luck is needed along the way each season, along with the odd injection of cash.
My wife and two other members of staff were made redundant, regardless of the right and wrongs and my opinion of that, what do you think that does for the mind set of those staff that remain. It doesn't mean any of them will lose their jobs but, for some of them, there is a self-perceived shadow hanging over them and coupled with the team on the pitch having a rough time the mood can be, at times, nothing short of depressing (don't forget I was at the club when we did make the drop, it was gut-wrenching).
I have fallen out of love with TUFC, for personal reasons, and I should also be honest and say that I am a massive, lifelong supporter of Ipswich Town (a glutton for punishment, I know) but if you will allow me to suggest that, at the danger of repeating myself, supporting the club doesn't mean you endorse the decisions of the manager, directors or even the players. TUFC is an entity in itself to be cherished by those of you who can see past the odd dodgy substitution, fall out between player and manager and bizarre ticketing arrangement by the admin team or whatever else you see going 'wrong'.

As someone who has worked at TUFC on the media side of things I can perhaps give some background on 'club statements'. Any football club (or business in general) is only likely to send forth a statement to the public if a particular situation has changed or if the inner politics of the club are served better by those with the power to issue such statements decide to 'go public'. A few seasons ago I was involved in a three-way conversation with two former employees on the football side of things on whether a statement should be issued on a team based topic. The older (wiser?) head of the three of us decided that it would not be in the best interests of the club to issue any statement although it was a matter that directly affected the team out on the pitch and, it could be argued, therefore was in the interests of the paying public. The point I am trying to make (and has already probably been pointed out in a different way in previous posts) is that just because a statement is not made at a certain time it simply does not mean that conversations covering all angles of said situation are not taking place. Don't forget that there is a group of directors very rarely (if ever) all in the same room at the same time and while Thea has a 'support base' of a small sub-group of directors beneath her it doesn't mean they are going to make any decision for the long term without consulting their colleagues which can and does take time.

Those of you who know me will be aware that it was Kerry, my wife, who was made redundant a short while ago but I have not posted on the site to grind any axes. In fact I would, as someone who has watched United since I was 11, back those who are asking supporters to back the club, not necessarily individuals within its working structure, but Torquay United FC. Some of you will know as well as I do that there are characters at Plainmoor who do not deserve the role that they carry out and are basically on an ego trip but you are back on the inner politics bandwagon again with that and it occurs at every club to be honest. A couple of wins, however lucky, can change things on the pitch very quickly but it is off the pitch where the real challenge for TUFC exists. Commercially it always has to be 'eyeballs out' 12 months of the year and the club has made no secret that further new investment is vital. These and other off-pitch issues are actually more important for the long-term future of the club than what happens on the field of play but it will always be the manager and players that take the abuse because they are the public face of the club, that's football I suppose. Don't underestimate the non-football side of things (it's a bit like the duck on the water - on the surface all looks fine while under the water it's a struggle to stay afloat!!). The future of TUFC will be decided away from the pitch and, correctly, in privacy. The correct decisions may or may not be made and those that make them will ultimately have to put their heads above the trench and accept the consequences but until that happens just support whoever is stood in the dug-out and whoever is on the pitch......

[quote="Southampton Gull"]I called Sally Eagling when we got to the BSP play-off final and she arranged everything. Maybe Kerry has too much on her plate to bother with looking after the fans.[/quote]

What exactly do you mean Dave with the line concerning Kerry not bothering looking after the fans?