Any update on Lingy?

[oxgull]

Martin is a decent man who has worked hard for this club. I too wish him the very best in his recovery and hope he returns soon. Whether or not he returns to manage Torquay United is another issue as his long term health and happiness is the main thing. Our predicamant at the foot of the league shouldn't be blamed entirely on Martin as we don't know the facts and there are many other factors involved. Right now we need all three points tonight as that will make him feel a whole lot better (and me to!!). Either way it will all come out later.

[cambgull]

Not that I wish to launch a mechanics tool into some workings here, but when I'm off sick from work, I don't go out. If I'm too ill to get to work, I'm too ill to stand on a freezing cold touchline for 90 minutes while my son plays football.

Just saying...

[Alpine Joe]

I don't think your spanner will cause any problems cambgull. With guesswork and speculation over someone that's ill there'll always be the argument whether you're better off 'just saying' or not saying.

I think most realise there are all types of illness and for a good number of them it doesn't matter in the least whether you stay indoors or go outside. For certain things you'd probably be encouraged to go out and mix with people to aid your recovery.

If we're certain that Martin's doctor has advised him to 'stay in and wrap up warm' then you've a valid point in asking why he's ventured beyond his front door with his son. Then again, for a man who is used to spending part of most days outside on a training field then being cooped up indoors for weeks on end could be less beneficial than going out to get some fresh air.

The only conclusion you'll reach is that Martin may not be suffering from something similar to that which has kept you off work in the past.

Hopefully everyone, whether they think the speculation is in bad taste or whether they thoroughly enjoy the medical guessing games will unite in wishing Lingy all the best for a full recovery.

[tauntongull]

I am still enraged by Martin's comments earlier in the season that 'We overachieved' last season and the Torquay fans should get real!

Neither of these comments were productive and incidentally came when we began our poor run of form. Comments such as these do nothing to boost moral of fans or players and I am absolutely convinced these comments led to a step down in performance from some key players.

We're certainly not overachieving now - so thanks for that!

[AustrianAndyGull]

Now we have our 'new' boss predicting a winning run when we've been playing like circus acts for the past 4 months and won 1 game since the 1st of December. I'm all for talking positive but there's that and theres clear insanity. You couldn't make it up.

[Richinns]

I am confident when I say that if Martin was still in charge we would be clear of any real relegation worries. Yes we have played poorly this year (both under him and without him) but the real turn of the shocking run of results came after he had to leave due to health issues. We should have reacted quicker than we did but and we set ourselves on a downward spiral from that point when we failed to do so.

I have no real idea what is wrong with Lingy but I do honestly wish him all the best and hope he returns next year with us as a League team. Both feel unlikely at the moment I know.

[AustrianAndyGull]

I am confident when I say that if Martin was still in charge we would be clear of any real relegation worries. Yes we have played poorly this year (both under him and without him) but the real turn of the shocking run of results came after he had to leave due to health issues. We should have reacted quicker than we did but and we set ourselves on a downward spiral from that point when we failed to do so.

I have no real idea what is wrong with Lingy but I do honestly wish him all the best and hope he returns next year with us as a League team. Both feel unlikely at the moment I know.

Totally disagree there Rich, sorry mate. We were poor in October when i ( and others ) first had serious concerns about our style of play. In November we somehow managed to beat York despite having only 2 half chances and getting battered by them in the second half. Other results in November included a 4-1 home hammering at the hands of Southend, the defeat to Harrogate in the FA Cup, defeat at Barnet and a 0-0 at Oxford where Rene was banned so we all predicted a shut up shop attitude and duly got it all because we rely on one striker.

In December we somehow managed to get a win out of the home game with Dagenham in part thanks to an own goal, we chucked away late leads at home to Northampton and away at Plymouth and in between that was an appalling loss at Bradford when Saah was sent off.

January saw us lose comedically at home to AFC Wimbledon in the last minute and i think Ling went off ill then. The theme throughout these 4 or 5 months was consistently atrocious football. So Rich, i have no idea where you're coming from mate but i like the debate.

[divingbboy]

but the real turn of the shocking run of results came after he had to leave due to health issues.

Don't really agree with that. We'd started playing poorly a fair bit before he left. Given how subdued he was on the touch line during that period, however, I do wonder whether he was ill long before he decided to take sick leave.

[Richinns]

Totally disagree there Rich, sorry mate. We were poor in October when i ( and others ) first had serious concerns about our style of play. In November we somehow managed to beat York despite having only 2 half chances and getting battered by them in the second half. Other results in November included a 4-1 home hammering at the hands of Southend, the defeat to Harrogate in the FA Cup, defeat at Barnet and a 0-0 at Oxford where Rene was banned so we all predicted a shut up shop attitude and duly got it all because we rely on one striker.

In December we somehow managed to get a win out of the home game with Dagenham in part thanks to an own goal, we chucked away late leads at home to Northampton and away at Plymouth and in between that was an appalling loss at Bradford when Saah was sent off.

January saw us lose comedically at home to AFC Wimbledon in the last minute and i think Ling went off ill then. The theme throughout these 4 or 5 months was consistently atrocious football. So Rich, i have no idea where you're coming from mate but i like the debate.

Yes there were some shocking performances and results under Ling this year BUT the seven losses in a row came after he had to leave due to health reasons. We (and he) have had a poor season to that point but if you took the average points accumulated under Martin this year and apply this to the games we had left after he left then we would have ended up safe by a comfortable margin. (Under Ling - 26 games/34 points = 1.307 points a game so over a season = 46 x 1.307 = 60.12 points).

The crisis came as a result of Ling having to depart - before that is was just a big issue which needed addressing.

[Bitchie Renault]

Yes there were some shocking performances and results under Ling this year BUT the seven losses in a row came after he had to leave due to health reasons. We (and he) have had a poor season to that point but if you took the average points accumulated under Martin this year and apply this to the games we had left after he left then we would have ended up safe by a comfortable margin. (Under Ling - 26 games/34 points = 1.307 points a game so over a season = 46 x 1.307 = 60.12 points).

The crisis came as a result of Ling having to depart - before that is was just a big issue which needed addressing.

It doesn't tell the whole story, but this is a very valid point by Richinns. There's no doubt we weren't playing scintilating football in the final few weeks leading up to Lingy leaving but we were still picking up points. There was a worrying habit of conceding late goals creeping into the team and maybe this was the first inkling of some issues with tactics, morale or substitutions not being utilised to the best effect, possibly linked to Martin's deteriating health. We shouldn't forget, this season Lingy masterminded some good wins including against Gillingham who were on fire at the time and the amazing comeback against Aldershot.

Realistically this season was always going to be a transitional one, losing class players like O'Kane and Olejnic (two of the most gifted players to ever appear for the Gulls) was always going to be tough. For all the blinkered complaints, how some people talk about this season/manager/players being the worst ever, there really is a massive loss of perspective. We have been so much worse than this on several occasions in my 35 years watching. There were times when we had no expectation because we were consistently awful for year after year after year. Now we have raised the bar considerably with our recent relative success, some of the newer fans presume this is the norm and expect perfection.

Anyway as this thread is with regard to ML's health, I'll get back on topic. I wish him all the best, I hope he's left in peace to get himself back to full health. Whether he comes back to us or not, he will forever hold a place of high esteme in my football supporting memory for his achievements at our club, get well soon.

[Jerry]

I am still enraged by Martin's comments earlier in the season that 'We overachieved' last season and the Torquay fans should get real!

Enraged?

Bit of an over reaction don't you think?

[Modgull]

Whatever the truth and whoever is to blame I think it is likely that this whole weird episode is directly responsible for our current difficulties and possible demise.

Other managers have become ill mid-season and had to take time out (Harry Redknap comes to mind) but surely the way this has been handled has had a negative effect on the playing side of the Club and the supporters.

Stranger than fiction - it can only happen at TUFC!!!

[Scott Brehaut]

Look at Spurs after 'arry won his court case and was touted for England manager - they couldn't buy a win....I'm sure that this episode has had some effect on our play.

[Dave]

Not that I wish to launch a mechanics tool into some workings here, but when I'm off sick from work, I don't go out. If I'm too ill to get to work, I'm too ill to stand on a freezing cold touchline for 90 minutes while my son plays football.

Just saying...

As said I think it depends on what it is that is keeping you off work.

As a general point I am reliably informed that Martin Ling actually spent most of his time Saturday either in his car or in the tea room, and did not spend much or if any time stood outside.

Do not think there are any medical guessing games going on here Alpine, the guy is clearly very ill and right now it as a subject should be left alone, and thats is what I am trying to encourage in my replies.

[hector]

[quote="Richinns" "austrianandygull"
Totally disagree there Rich, sorry mate. We were poor in October when i ( and others ) first had serious concerns about our style of play. In November we somehow managed to beat York despite having only 2 half chances and getting battered by them in the second half. Other results in November included a 4-1 home hammering at the hands of Southend, the defeat to Harrogate in the FA Cup, defeat at Barnet and a 0-0 at Oxford where Rene was banned so we all predicted a shut up shop attitude and duly got it all because we rely on one striker.

In December we somehow managed to get a win out of the home game with Dagenham in part thanks to an own goal, we chucked away late leads at home to Northampton and away at Plymouth and in between that was an appalling loss at Bradford when Saah was sent off.

January saw us lose comedically at home to AFC Wimbledon in the last minute and i think Ling went off ill then. The theme throughout these 4 or 5 months was consistently atrocious football. So Rich, i have no idea where you're coming from mate but i like the debate.

Yes there were some shocking performances and results under Ling this year BUT the seven losses in a row came after he had to leave due to health reasons. We (and he) have had a poor season to that point but if you took the average points accumulated under Martin this year and apply this to the games we had left after he left then we would have ended up safe by a comfortable margin. (Under Ling - 26 games/34 points = 1.307 points a game so over a season = 46 x 1.307 = 60.12 points).

The crisis came as a result of Ling having to depart - before that is was just a big issue which needed addressing.[/quote]

You can make the statistics say what you like. The fact is most of those points came before November. Once we hit the end of October, we only won another TWO games under Martin Ling. Whilst you can average it out over a longer period of time to make it look good, equally, you can point to the very clear sign that our form was simply dreadful from Halloween onwards. Before he went off sick, we had that silly run of throwing games away in the 85th minute, so it is not beyond the realms of probability that we could have endured this run whether he had stayed or not.