Ling Sacked

[Trojan 67]

Has anyone here seen my old friend Martin?
Can you tell me where he's gone ? . . . . . .
He would have freed a lot of people . . . . . .
But it seems the good get hung . . . . . .
I just looked around . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. . . . . . . and he was gone . . . . . .

[stevegull]

I don't want to get drawn into a massive debate on this because there have been 9 pages already and I've got other things to be doing, but I'll just say my piece.

I'm disappointed. I've said it elsewhere but I'm a passionate believer in second chances, and in people's ability to change. I think Martin Ling has been robbed of that opportunity today. It would also seem that the manner in which it has all come out is pretty shambolic, as we've come to expect.

I also feel that people are showing a worrying lack of memory and very quickly jumping to conclusions - some kind of black and white picture where Ling ruined the club and Knill saved it. A fairytale triumph of good over evil. Make no mistake - the fact that we are still a League club is largely down to Knill's hard work, but who's to say if he took over (people seem to forget that the word 'if' still applies) things would work the same way? It would be a very different task, and he wouldn't have the kind of kitchen sink support he had from the board towards the end of the season. We are forgetting that Martin Ling brought in Rene Howe, Brian Saah, Aaron Downes and Bobby Olejnik. He encouraged the likes of Lathrope and Oastler to make their mark on the first team, he got the best out of Mansell and Stevens, and he was the first person to give Macklin an honest assessment on the direction of his career. His honesty, particularly coming after Buckle, was refreshing. There is nothing to suggest that, if he came back refreshed and ready for the challenge, we wouldn't have another successful season. There is certainly nothing to suggest that Knill would do any better.

I feel bad that this was the last comment on a page and it deserves to be seen by more. I agree entirely on all your points.

[Southampton Gull]

I don't want to get drawn into a massive debate on this because there have been 9 pages already and I've got other things to be doing, but I'll just say my piece.

I'm disappointed. I've said it elsewhere but I'm a passionate believer in second chances, and in people's ability to change. I think Martin Ling has been robbed of that opportunity today. It would also seem that the manner in which it has all come out is pretty shambolic, as we've come to expect.

I also feel that people are showing a worrying lack of memory and very quickly jumping to conclusions - some kind of black and white picture where Ling ruined the club and Knill saved it. A fairytale triumph of good over evil. Make no mistake - the fact that we are still a League club is largely down to Knill's hard work, but who's to say if he took over (people seem to forget that the word 'if' still applies) things would work the same way? It would be a very different task, and he wouldn't have the kind of kitchen sink support he had from the board towards the end of the season. We are forgetting that Martin Ling brought in Rene Howe, Brian Saah, Aaron Downes and Bobby Olejnik. He encouraged the likes of Lathrope and Oastler to make their mark on the first team, he got the best out of Mansell and Stevens, and he was the first person to give Macklin an honest assessment on the direction of his career. His honesty, particularly coming after Buckle, was refreshing. There is nothing to suggest that, if he came back refreshed and ready for the challenge, we wouldn't have another successful season. There is certainly nothing to suggest that Knill would do any better.

You echo my thoughts entirely.

[Dave]

Christ I turn my back for half a day...

Do not think this is much of a surprise, did say thought Lingy's return was not guaranteed allthough did not know that for sure. Once he went sick and Knill was brought in there was allways the danger of Lingy's position becoming untenable.

Right lets atleast try to bring some sense to this, unfair dissmissal really where is the case for that ? For a start unless the club gave a written assurance to Lingy his job as first team manager was safe , it would become Lingy's word against the club's, just because Martin Ling says it, doesn't mean it's true.

And if Martin Ling did seek an assurance his job would be safe, what would anybody including Lingy expect the club to say. Incase anyone had not noticed we at that time were in a real relegation scrap, the club were not going tell Lingy or the players they were going to make a change at the end of the season were they and completely unsettle every player.

And we still do not actually know what this illness was do we, stress-related could mean anything, including what has been suggested by some on here.

Anyway enough of that, it's wrong to dance on his grave so to speak, after all he did do a very job for 1 + 1/2 seasons, yep it all went wrong but we must not forget the good times we had under Lingy aswell.

So I would like to thank Martin Ling and wish him well for the future.

[Trojan 67]

Christ I turn my back for half a day...

[Scott Brehaut]

I don't want to get drawn into a massive debate on this because there have been 9 pages already and I've got other things to be doing, but I'll just say my piece.

I'm disappointed. I've said it elsewhere but I'm a passionate believer in second chances, and in people's ability to change. I think Martin Ling has been robbed of that opportunity today. It would also seem that the manner in which it has all come out is pretty shambolic, as we've come to expect.

I also feel that people are showing a worrying lack of memory and very quickly jumping to conclusions - some kind of black and white picture where Ling ruined the club and Knill saved it. A fairytale triumph of good over evil. Make no mistake - the fact that we are still a League club is largely down to Knill's hard work, but who's to say if he took over (people seem to forget that the word 'if' still applies) things would work the same way? It would be a very different task, and he wouldn't have the kind of kitchen sink support he had from the board towards the end of the season. We are forgetting that Martin Ling brought in Rene Howe, Brian Saah, Aaron Downes and Bobby Olejnik. He encouraged the likes of Lathrope and Oastler to make their mark on the first team, he got the best out of Mansell and Stevens, and he was the first person to give Macklin an honest assessment on the direction of his career. His honesty, particularly coming after Buckle, was refreshing. There is nothing to suggest that, if he came back refreshed and ready for the challenge, we wouldn't have another successful season. There is certainly nothing to suggest that Knill would do any better.

[bobby93]

I have to say, I was ripped apart for expressing similar statements on Facebook, so thanks for not doing that!

[Dave_Pougher]

I don't want to get drawn into a massive debate on this because there have been 9 pages already and I've got other things to be doing, but I'll just say my piece.

I'm disappointed. I've said it elsewhere but I'm a passionate believer in second chances, and in people's ability to change. I think Martin Ling has been robbed of that opportunity today. It would also seem that the manner in which it has all come out is pretty shambolic, as we've come to expect.

I also feel that people are showing a worrying lack of memory and very quickly jumping to conclusions - some kind of black and white picture where Ling ruined the club and Knill saved it. A fairytale triumph of good over evil. Make no mistake - the fact that we are still a League club is largely down to Knill's hard work, but who's to say if he took over (people seem to forget that the word 'if' still applies) things would work the same way? It would be a very different task, and he wouldn't have the kind of kitchen sink support he had from the board towards the end of the season. We are forgetting that Martin Ling brought in Rene Howe, Brian Saah, Aaron Downes and Bobby Olejnik. He encouraged the likes of Lathrope and Oastler to make their mark on the first team, he got the best out of Mansell and Stevens, and he was the first person to give Macklin an honest assessment on the direction of his career. His honesty, particularly coming after Buckle, was refreshing. There is nothing to suggest that, if he came back refreshed and ready for the challenge, we wouldn't have another successful season. There is certainly nothing to suggest that Knill would do any better.

Top post,

What made Ling go from being a winner to a loser? Have no idea,, just a coincedence it happened in the transfer window I suppose.

[Fonda]

Ling bought some decent players to the club. And he seems like a decent chap. But he preached a style of football that was dreadfully dull. The kind of football that results in diminishing attendances in fact. And perhaps, with his constant returns to the South East, did not display the kind of dedication the board demanded? Maybe Knill, in his short time in an unpaid position gave indication of greater work rate and desire? I don't know how successful AK would ultimately prove if given the role - a fire-fighting mission is very different to building a squad for promotion. But if I didn't know the background of the situation, and was comparing the performance of both men this season, I know who I'd put my trust in, ongoing. One inspires me more than the other...

[Kernowgull]

I agree a fire fighting mission is very different, but Knill seems to have contacts at big clubs. By all accounts we were after someone from Old Trafford on loan. It may be tough to get players down here, but its not impossible, and I don't think we've had a real northern based manager before.

The style of football we have tried to play under Knill has been refreshing, and if we can get another O Kane on loan from a top club I think we'll do well with Knill.

[Trojan 67]

What made Ling go from being a winner to a loser? Have no idea,, just a coincedence it happened in the transfer window I suppose.

The retained list will in part answer the question.

He's another question : Would you trust players who went missing for a couple of months, only to turn up again when THEIR livelihoods were at stake?

I look forward to the next big debate (retained list) with interest.

[Plymouth Gull]

Bobby, that is a well-written post. However, on the same token, there is nothing to suggest that Ling may have had a relapse of his problem this season and then we're back down sh*t creek again.

I fully appreciate all the work that Ling has done for the club over last two years, he has given us some excellent memories like the Argyle double last season and the win at Rovers against Buckle, and like you say, his honesty after Buckle was great, but I think the relationship has run it's course. I hope that we don't see any sour events now through legal challenges from Ling, I hope he and the club can agree to these terms and we can both move on.

Thank you for all your hard work Martin, and good luck in the future. Sure to get a good reception if you ever return to Plainmoor, from me, anyway.

[Dave]

Bobby, that is a well-written post. However, on the same token, there is nothing to suggest that Ling may have had a relapse of his problem this season and then we're back down sh*t creek again.

I fully appreciate all the work that Ling has done for the club over last two years, he has given us some excellent memories like the Argyle double last season and the win at Rovers against Buckle, and like you say, his honesty after Buckle was great, but I think the relationship has run it's course. I hope that we don't see any sour events now through legal challenges from Ling, I hope he and the club can agree to these terms and we can both move on.

Thank you for all your hard work Martin, and good luck in the future. Sure to get a good reception if you ever return to Plainmoor, from me, anyway.

Agreed, pretty much I feel, but could never have written it so well.

[Jeff]

I'd been reasonably indifferent on the whole thing.

Ling did a fantastic job last season, hastily building a squad and - after a little trial and error - made us into a results machine.

I think his downfall was trying to recreate that without the same personnel. He fell foul of the ideology that supporters will tolerate sh*t football if its successful. Watching games this year for me certainly hadnt had the same entertainment factor, and I was finding better things to do on a Saturday. I suspect many others were of the same opinion, and perhaps the board recognised that. I'm surprised they actually went through with it, but they did it at the right time. It's a natural time for one chapter to close, and another to begin.

As to whether Knill is the answer, I don't know - although the telling mannerisms in Bakers interview yesterday suggest the board favour him. And I imagine the coincidental family holiday in the area this week is more a case of getting the other half down to the area to look for a place to live.

As for results, I think it's too early to judge Knill. He was brought in with a remit - to save the club. That was using a team shaped by someone else, honed on their methods and with their backroom. To an small extent he was able to make his mark on the team, and with some shrewd signings - and achieved his goal. To really see what he's got, he needs backing from the board and to build a team himself.

At this stage, I think the board would be foolish to go with anyone other than Knill as first choice, as he has got much of the fans backing. If we were to go elsewhere, the only choice I can see is Chris Hargreaves. You can say what you like about inexperience, but a guy who has worked under so many managers and coaches must have picked up some good practice and knowledge. And the amount of players he has played with or against are now of the right generation to be in coaching - so he should have a number of contacts to call on. Having a rookie manager didn't work out too badly with Buckle, and everyone has to start somewhere. He's well respected, and has "bought into" the area so would have my backing.

Either way, I think on the whole this is a positive day for the club. They have to act quickly to make the benefits pay off, otherwise the momentum is lost.

[nickbrod]

The one person who can end all this speculation and conjecture is Martin Ling himself. He needs to give a candid interview to explain his side of the story ie his 'problem' resulting in his absence.
If not why would any club offer him a manager's job? At the moment without any proven facts it would be a big gamble for another club to take him on.