FA proposing League Structure changes

[diamondgirl]

This proposal is not a fix for English football, just the pandering to premiership wealth, and a nail in the coffin of lower league clubs.

[Kit_robin]

The whole idea is completely flawed from top to bottom. The commission has completely ignored the fact that the real issue is not howany English players in total are playing in the Premier League, but the quality of those English players.

When the top league in England was predominantly made up of English players I don't recall the England national side winning tournament after tournament. Look at the 70s. Look at the poor showing in '92, and complete failure to qualify in '94. Having more English players does not guarantee success if all that happens is players like Andy Sinton and Carlton Palmer are playing for top clubs.

We need to seriously look at two things: coaching and the large squads and power PL clubs have. If we coached players of requisite quality, they would play in the premier league now (like Sterling, Shaw and Barkley). The reason the others don't play is because they are not 'elite' players; the very group this commission is trying to promote. All that happens is someone like Neil Mellor would be playing week in week out, rather than finding his natural level lower down.

And why don't the elite players play (if indeed they don't)? Because the PL squad have huge squads. Stop the massive squads and players will naturally drop down to lower leagues anyway.

The whole idea is built on the presumption that more English players playing the stronger the national side, when in reality the strength of the national side rests purely on the quality of the players it contains.

[frenchgull]

This is a crazy idea,why mess up leagues one and two just for the rich premier clubs,the arrogance of them to think diehard supporters of lower league sides would prefer to watch young kids who no one every heard of just because they wear a red man u shirt,rediculous.let them have a league of their own and just see how many people would go and watch,very few I suspect.
Mind you,I used to watch Torquay reserves play in the western league many many years ago,it was good to help injured players back and others to force their way into the first team and I suspect the likes of Chippenham Town looked forward to a visit from Torquay!.

[stevegull]

I spewed my views onto a webpage.

I actually wrote it before the plans were confirmed. Farcical if it is allowed to come in.

Yet another example of the bigger league shitting on the little guy.

http://www.westernmorningnews.co.uk/FA- ... story.html

[Oil Beef Hooked]

Can someone please explain to me why/ how Greg Dyke works for the FA?

What he knows about football, especially lower league football you could probably write on an ant's cock.

This is a poorly thought out idea and one that will only end in tears for the likes of you and I who support a lower league team.

[tomogull]

The good news is that opposition to this hair-brained proposal seems to be growing by the minute. The Football League and Conference clubs must unite to make sure the current pyramid system is not destroyed. Dyke was a total failure when he was Director General (?) of the BBC and now he seems intent on screwing up football in this country. He's a total pr*ck.

[AustrianAndyGull]

Greg Dyke is a total vagina. Danny Mills is a total hairy vagina and the FA are filled with vagina's. They are basically legalised sex workers. All of them.

Again it's about common sense. How many times have you read stories in the local rags about traffic issues, policy issues with the local council etc etc when there really need not have been any story at all if common sense had been applied. Same here. Apply common sense to this issue and it would be quickly apparent to anyone with half a nut that the proposal Dyke suggests is first of all unworkable on so many levels but also not common sense.

I presume it will make him lots of money AND feed his ego so therefore like all politicians and car salesmen, the decision came to him like an angel in the night. Sweet baby Jesus! It's a piece of piss for him. Make the decision, if it fails he gets a load of cash and moves on to CEO of Cromwells Certificated Bailiffs where he continues to make more bizarre decisions and get even more cash. Once your in, your in.

I sincerely hope that Dyke and his cronies are somehow involved in a freak hot air ballooning incident which results in temporary hospitalization. Time then to think about what REALLY matters. TOSSER.

[Gullscorer]

Scudamore speaks a little sense: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27340856

[BayGull]

Sign the petition here:

http://www.againstleague3.co.uk/

[gullintwoplaces]

I would just like to share a comment that I made on an Everton forum (called "ToffeeTalk, for the thinking Evertonian, a complete joke that!). I heard that some of these thinking Evertonians were saying that they had "earned the right" to have a B team in the League (yes, really). So I have been debating with folk that just will not listen. Gullscorer has said on another thread that we should use "reasoned argument". Well I tried that with the comment below! I found a reference to an article that explains the damage done by having Bundesliga B teams in the German second tier, the Everton c**ts don't want to hear this at all. The article is worth a read: [url]http://www.wsc.co.uk...8-the-killer-bs[/url]

Anyway, my comments was as follows, I hope it helps debate:


"""Have you even read the article that I attached? I think you don't want to listen to anything I have said. Let me put it very simply then, supporters of lower league sides and their clubs will not accept these proposals under any circumstances. Why? Just look at what would happen:

Year 1
League 3 is formed, 10 Conference sides, 10 Premiership Reserve teams. Fourteen Conference sides are therefore effectively relegated further away from Leagues 1and 2 at a swoop. The 10 Conference sides in League 3 can now "look forward" to home games against the ten reserve sides (the majority of their home games) with no away fans attending. No atmosphere, no banter, lower crowds, no prospect whatsoever or TV interest in the game (Halifax v Stoke City Reserves? Come on!).

Consequence of year 1 - the 10 former conference sides couldn't compete with the Premiership Reserve sides' resources, two of the Reserve Sides finish top and are promoted. The impact of year 1 on the finances of the 10 former Conference sides is disastrous, lost gate money, disenchanted fans, no prospect of promotion until all the Reserve sides have gone up (5 years of this!). 1 or 2 former Conference sides go bust.

Year 2
Two Reserve sides in League 2, both promoted to League 1.

Consequence of year 2 - Limited prospects for promotion now for League 2 sides (they also can't compete with Premiership resources) with years of this decay to follow. Fans become disenchanted.
More former Conference sides in financial difficulty as the second year of a lot of home games with no away fans, no atmosphere at games, no banter, no prospect of promotion continues. More go bust.

Year 3
Two Reserve sides in League 1, their final destination. They of course will finish top, denying promotion to other sides. The Championship sides will love this, as the sides that are due to be promoted cannot go up (no Reserve sides will be allowed in the Championship).

Consequence of Year 3 - the Championship begins to ossify, no relegation for years to come. League 1 and League 2 supporters don't bother going to games, nothing to fight for as no/limited promotion prospects. No away fans for home games against Reserve sides, decay begins. Some clubs on the edge financially.

Subsequent years
The Championship ossifies, League 1 and 2 non Reserve league sides' fans resent lack of promotion, lack of atmosphere at home games and begin to stay away. The damage to the former Conference sides in League 3 has already been done.

The Premiership sides who don't have a B team in the League demand entry too. The process goes around again.

Consequence, Dyke and his hare brained scheme have destroyed a League pyramid structure that has given fans entertainment and good football for many years. Creating a competitive Premiership Reserve League NOW would be far better and cause far less damage.


And what is all this for? To make England better? Well it won't, England haven't competed on the international scene well for years. The problem is lack of coaching, lack of facilities (who sold off school playing fields?), inappropriate approaches to schoolboy football that crush future stars, short termism by Premiership sides. By the last comment I mean that Premiership fans and owners demand instant success, so the home grown talent doesn't get a chance. Eventually the home talent leaves, their ambition crushed. And if you seriously think that the League 3 proposals will develop home talent then you want your head read.

In short the solution to England's failure is not League 3. The causes are complex, but blame lies at the door of the useless, incompetent FA, stuffed full of men with blazers who love to go on junkets. It also lies with the greed of the Premiership and the Governments who sold the playing fields that our kids used to use. """


It may be emotive, but I feel very emotional about this issue, as it would finish off the League structure that we know and the teams that we love. I have suggested in my comment that at some stage the other Premiership teams will want their B teams in as well. The end result of this would be a League 1 that consists almost entirely of Premiership Reserve teams not able to be promoted. League 2 would be a deathly place, with the promotions being largely the Premiership Reserve sides relegated from League 1 the previous year. League 1 would essentially form a barrier between the Championship and the hoi polloi, a terrible prospect. I have explained that the fans of clubs in League 1, 2 and the Conference do not want to see that the next game for their club is home to Stoke City reserves, with no away fans, no passion, no banter and nothing whatsoever to play for. Why not just have a reserve league for Premiership clubs that DOESN'T act as a barrier between the Championship and League 1?

The selfishness of these people is staggering. They already have a team in the Premiership, now they want their reserves to play in and screw up our League. And they think that they have "earned" the right to screw us up, bastards.

[Dutchgull]

Not a good post a brilliant post. Well done sir.

[Gullscorer]

Not a good post a brilliant post. Well done sir.

Agreed.

[chunkygull]

.In the words of Andy Gray -

"That wasnt good, that wasnt great, that was Magnificent! Take a bow Son."

What a brilliant well thought out post, a few points in there I was thinking myself but couldnt put into words like that.

All I can say to you Gullintwoplaces is

You really should email that to the FA, The football League, The Premier League, Football clubs, Daily newspapers, Talksport and anyone else involved.

Brilliant!

[ferrarilover]

It looks lovely, and the sentiment is something that we can all rally around, but it suffers from being made up entirely of emotive speculation and little else.

That there will be no TV interest is at best exactly the same as the present situation in both L2 and the Conference. At worst, there will be greatly increased interest from the TV people who, frankly, would watch a tramp having a shit if he did it while wearing a Man City shirt. I'd suggest that, if anything, there'd be a net increase in the division from TV, given that it would be yet another Manchester derby or Chelsea v Arsenal. No matter that it's the reserves, the kids will lap it up.
The no away fans thing is perhaps also false. I haven't the will to look too deeply, but a quick look on Google shows that Man City's Elite Development Squad (the kids, one step below the reserves) manage sometimes to attract over 4000 people to games. If Hayes and Yeading can get fans to away matches, I don't see that we'll succeed in arguing that Man Utd, Chelsea and Liverpool won't take anyone to reserve games.

While it's extremely likely that the reserve sides would be far too strong for the Conference teams, an imbalance of power isn't really a valid argument. Long since has the idea of divisions grouping teams of similar "size" gone west. When Accrington Stanley are in the same division as Portsmouth, it's time to give up on the "they're too big, it's not fair" argument. No, it's not the situation we want to see, but the cream shall surely rise to the top and, if that's the 'B' teams, so be it.

I don't know that it would be a gimmie that the reserve sides would waltz L2. They might, but who knows. It would still leave one automatic place up for grabs and the four playoff places, as well as the two relegation places to avoid. The promotion angle is identical to that found in the Conference every year, and that doesn't seem to suffer as a result.

The most likely argument comes at the point where the reserve sides dominate L1 and effectively reduce the promotion places to one, via the playoffs. This arguably makes it a little more exciting, although that depends largely on your viewpoint.

Ultimately, it's not something any of us want to see, but if it will line the pockets of those who make the decisions, then it'll likely come about regardless.

Matt.

[gullintwoplaces]

Matt, are you seriously suggesting that the Premiership Reserve (B) teams would take fans to away games? Yes, I know that one in two of the Reserve sides might get reasonable home gates for some games, but away games? They get home gates because the first team is away and that is all. My argument that home games against these B teams would be sterile and pointless is, I maintain, valid.

What I wrote was emotive, but football is an emotional business. My emotion tells me that I would like Greg Dyke to move to Afghanistan with Danny Mills and the rest of the FA Commission.

You may well be right that the proposed mad change will happen anyway, but there is a lot of opposition and I am more hopeful than you are. The Premiership fans that want this change are, to me, despicable pieces of excrement.