Chris Hargreaves services?

[SBP]

Levis has improved

Do you think so, I don't think he has.

[Dave]

Martin Ling had worse training ground than we have now, he also had financial constraints and the same location, we were in League 2 competing against Swindon, Crawley and other clubs who were all full time and had more money in their petty cash than we did in the whole club, didn't seem to cause him any problems.

There's the likes of Liam Daish and Alan Devonshire out there available free agents, proven at that level, know how to put on squad together with nothing, yes please.

[A Realist]

Do you think so, I don't think he has.

Neither do I and although for some reason he seems to get good reports by one local pressman, he is not good enough even for the conference. At least not as a left back. He has been targeted by opposing teams and a fair amount of goals conceded have come down his side.

Imo he may be worth trying as a left midfielder or as a wing back in a team that plays 3 centre halfs. Although he has had some half decent games, all in all he's been more of a liability than an asset. I know he's only a kid but I honestly cannot see him playing at a much higher level than he currently is.

[goodluckgull]

Forever, although Lingy had financial constraints are they the same as what Greavsie had this season ? I do rememeber Lingy saying it is difficult to recruit players to Torquay and to say it "didn't cause him any problems" is wrong.

[Dave]

I'd say the financial constraints Martin Ling worked under were worse than Chris Hargreaves, look at what we were competing against(teams who could pay £2k a week) and the going rate for league 2 players, we're now in the conference where we're competing against sides, who by and large haven't got the resources we have, and the going rate for conference players is a lot lower.

[arcadia]

Levi is a talented 18 year old who has prospects to progress to a higher level he's got his faults one where he wants to much time on the ball under pressure but Saturday he was sharp and constructive. I would say on Saturday he played his best home game and any scout watching would see the potential but not the end product as he is still improving thanks to Hargreaves playing him in men's football. The keeper will have benefited from playing at a young age as well and I hope that he gets the same chances next season.
We've got to wait to see if the new owners are willing to back Chris Hargreaves would you give him your money?

[arcadia]

The key question is will the new owners have the money to consider that option. If they want to replace Hargreaves - and that would probably include Hodges too - then they are going to have to write two fat cheques. They may decide instead to use that money to increase the playing budget and keep Hargreaves in charge.

Unless the new owners already have someone lined up, the process of hiring a new manager could take a while and we'll be at a disadvantage in our recruitment drive for next season. Then there's the case of our current squad. Hargreaves is already releasing players which tells me that he expects to be here next season. Otherwise, surely he would be told by Thea/Kelvin not to tell any players whether or not they will be offered a new contract.

If they've kept it this quiet all this time they may have the managers position already sorted I'm sure if I was investing money that I would want a say in the manager.
I thought that McDonald was the only player to sign a new contract the ones that have been told they can go were obvious ones.

[exilegull]

I would keep him. If you ranked our players in order of performance this year, with the exception of Downes all the top half are Hargreaves recruits and all the bottom half are players he was lumbered with and probably consumed two thirds of the wage bill. For the money he had available for his own recruits he did ok.

There is no guarantee a new manager does any better and it is back to a start from scratch position - all the players he didn't want but was stuck with can now leave and it can finally be his team. Then next season there has to be progress visible by Xmas.

[tomogull]

I'm for giving Hargreaves more time but if he hasn't learnt from his failings this season and there is no improvement by November, then we should look elesewhere. Let's knock this 'it's the training pitch' excuse on the head. Before Seale Hayne, the club was using Newton Abbot racecourse as a training ground and that was under water much of the time yet somehow we managed to get promotions under Leroy and Paul Buckle. And we didn't have the facility of the all weather pitches at Paignton College.

Back in O'Farrell's time, and after O'Farrell, the players used to be sent on the Petitior Traning Run, up and down the cliff path, which they hated. I reckon it built up their stamina levels. There must be a question mark over some of the players fitness when you look at the number of points we've let slip this season in the closing stages of matches.

[nickbrod]

The average length of tenure of a Conference manager before achieving promotion is 38 months according to the Non-League Paper.

[Richinns]

Has he made mistakes? Undoubtedly
Does he take responsibility for a disappointing season? In part
Does he deserve more time? Without question

I was very much in the camp of we need to move on from Ling and get Knill in charge. Look what that did for us. The lesson that needs to be learnt is ' "be careful what you wish for".

He needs a chance for him to say this 'is my team' and this is how I want them to play and I would hope he is given that chance.

I think par this year (with the players he could not replace and therefore the budget at his disposal for new recruits) was 9th-10th so in reality the season was slightly below that. No doubt in was turgid and very depressing at times but our reality as to where we are as a club is reflected by that.

I don't think you can set objectives for him for next season as so much depends on the change of regime of the board and therefore the budget which he will be given to build his team. If he is given a bottom half budget that that is where we should place expectation but if he is given a budget which entitles us to challenge and the top end then ask questions and look at other options when we are failing to deliver that.

[Dave]

Not trying to call anyone out here, it's an open forum and this is meant for debate. Give him a chance to manage his 'own team' sorry what a load of complete and utter nonsense, very rarely does any manager, when he goes into a club and has the luxury of managing his own team. prime example Tim Sherwood, he'd been a manager for just 28 games when he took the Villa job, so less experience than CH, didn't have his own players, and has turned their fortunes around, and before anyone says it, doesn't matter whether it's top flight, league 2 or the south Devon league, football is football it's the same principle what ever level you're at, you can either manage a football team or you can't.

Same at Watford, their manager who's name I can't spell, been in charge for 35 games, not his players took them up. Same at Aldershot Chris Barker had no management experience and picked up 20 points from his 15 games after Andy Scott had lost 11 of his last 13 games in charge, weren't his players either.

I'm a TUFC fan, I want promotion next season end of, and if Chris Hargreaves achieves that, I will be only to delighted to come on here and eat a huge slice of humble pie. Any other manager but CH would have been kicked to bits for this season and rightly so, it's been appalling, he didn't just not achieve he failed big style, and what's frustrating is some fans are already peddling excuses for next season before this ones barely finished, I bet the master of excuses is loving that.

[goodluckgull]

I watched many training sessions at the racecourse in Newton Abbot and most of the time it was a reasonable flat surface. The ground would go very hard if there was a prolonged dry spell and very wet when it rained alot, but it still had better drainage than Seale Hayne.
For a long time the players had to train on quite a sloping pitch at Seale Hayne and when it was wet the ground was a mud quire. A large area was levelled but remained unplayable for a long time because it was just stones and now that the grass has eventually grown it has large areas sodden wet most of the time. There was even frog spawn in the puddles !
It is good that the players can use the all weather pitches at Paignton, but it is not the same as training on grass.

[Dave]

So if the racecourse training ground was so good, why did we move to Seale Hayne ? I actually know the Seale Hayne ground very well, Newton 66 junior football club had the ground before TUFC moved in, taken sides I've managed and played their, and my lad after his release from our academy played their for 1 year, could have told anyone at the club about the problems their, after all it's farm land.

[Richinns]

Not trying to call anyone out here, it's an open forum and this is meant for debate. Give him a chance to manage his 'own team' sorry what a load of complete and utter nonsense, very rarely does any manager, when he goes into a club and has the luxury of managing his own team. prime example Tim Sherwood, he'd been a manager for just 28 games when he took the Villa job, so less experience than CH, didn't have his own players, and has turned their fortunes around, and before anyone says it, doesn't matter whether it's top flight, league 2 or the south Devon league, football is football it's the same principle what ever level you're at, you can either manage a football team or you can't.

Same at Watford, their manager who's name I can't spell, been in charge for 35 games, not his players took them up. Same at Aldershot Chris Barker had no management experience and picked up 20 points from his 15 games after Andy Scott had lost 11 of his last 13 games in charge, weren't his players either.

I'm a TUFC fan, I want promotion next season end of, and if Chris Hargreaves achieves that, I will be only to delighted to come on here and eat a huge slice of humble pie. Any other manager but CH would have been kicked to bits for this season and rightly so, it's been appalling, he didn't just not achieve he failed big style, and what's frustrating is some fans are already peddling excuses for next season before this ones barely finished, I bet the master of excuses is loving that.

We have no divine right to get promotion because we have spent most of our existence in the football league. It is an unfair expectation if the playing budget does not match or better a significant number of others in the league. Many on here need to accept the fact we are at our level on the current finances we are able to provide. Sad but true and no sacking of a manager and replacing them with AN other is going to alter the facts and only result in further pain for the next guy through the door.

It is very simple but in the interests of those who finding it a little bit difficult to understand lets try and simplify it further - Put fuel in a car and it will go a certain distance. Fill it halfway and it will do half the amount of miles compared to if you fill the tank. You do not blame the petrol station manager because you cannot get 400 miles on 200 miles amount of petrol.

Now - if the likely budget for next year changes over the coming weeks - and a promotion challenge does not result from this next season then starting pointing fingers but if not then (as much as it hurts) stop looking for a scapegoat.

Of course this will not happen and eventually those (who already call the guy FARCEGREAVES - disgraceful in my book) will continue to vent their poison, get their man and further damage the club they claim to 'support'.