Season Ticket & Admission Price Reduction

Post by **MidDevon** » 21 May 2015, 11:48

I will not be renewing my season ticket on the bench this year, the first time I have not renewed my season ticket in many years.

Whilst I am very fortunate to be able to afford these sky high prices, I can see when I am being ripped off. I genuinely thought there would be a really interesting and great value offer from the club...how wrong was I. At a guess I would say only Cheltenham and Tranmere will be more expensive and that is why the ground is rarely even half full.

The club will not miss me, like my friend last year who gave up his season ticket, he had no call, no email, no letter, encouraging him to re apply. That's the club's choice but is probably one of the reasons people are not renewing.....it was certainly part of my reasoning

The sad thing is that I know I will very quickly get out of the habit of going, but the almost "duty bound" feeling I had last year is something I cannot tolerate this season.

As I run my own business and work long hours any time off I can manage is very critical to me, so I will be spending weekends on the odd Torquay match, but also on weekend breaks and more inspiring activities

frenchgull · Post by **frenchgull** » 21 May 2015, 13:47

Middevon,I am sure you are a good person but I hope that your business dose not have a bad time because according to you you would just pack it in and have another weekend away.You have the right to do want you want but the old saying , when the going gets tough the tough get going,has passed you by.

Post by **MidDevon** » 21 May 2015, 14:17

My business will not have a bad time because the directors are S&%£ hot !

Jerry · Post by **Jerry** » 21 May 2015, 18:10

MidDevon wrote:

At a guess I would say only Cheltenham and Tranmere will be more expensive and that is why the ground is rarely even half full.

Well your guess would be wrong then.

A season ticket for the Pop is cheaper than at Aldershot, Braintree, Tranmere and Woking.

Barrow's and Gateshead's cost the same as ours.

For between £5 and £10 less you can get a ticket at Bromley, Cheltenham, Dover and Macclesfield.

Seems to me if you want the club to challenge for a top half finish then we have the pricing just about right.

Post by **happytorq** » 22 May 2015, 14:26

Jerry wrote: Well your guess would be wrong then.

A season ticket for the Pop is cheaper than at Aldershot, Braintree, Tranmere and Woking.

Barrow's and Gateshead's cost the same as ours.

For between £5 and £10 less you can get a ticket at Bromley, Cheltenham, Dover and Macclesfield.

Seems to me if you want the club to challenge for a top half finish then we have the pricing just about right.

While I broadly agree with you, Jerry, it's not simply a function of 'ticket price'. When you consider the relative affordability of ticket prices you need to understand the level of disposable income in the area, which in Torbay is notoriously low. Places like Aldershot and Braintree in particular probably have a significantly higher average salary which could make the cost of a ticket lower when expressed as a proportion of disposable income.

I mean, we still need to charge what we can to increase the chance of doing well, of course - Im just saying that £300 in the home counties is easier to come by than £300 in, say, Brixham, generally speaking

Post by **MidDevon** » 22 May 2015, 15:21

Well I suppose the proof will be in next season's season ticket sales and attendances

I understand the club did not announce season ticket sales last season because they fell below 900 and they were rightly quite embarrassed.

When chaps like me say no, they have a problem

frenchgull · Post by **frenchgull** » 22 May 2015, 18:27

Hi Middevon,the club dose have a problem if as you say "chaps like you have stopped supporting". I find it difficult to understand how you can just stop supporting the club because we have had two or three crap seasons,blimey, you are either are one hundred percent behind the club you love or you just dip in and out until we start being sucsessfull again.I am glad your directors are s--t hot because your loyalty is very debatable.

chunkygull · Post by **chunkygull** » 22 May 2015, 19:17

Its not that some people stop being supporters or fans, its not about having a few crap seasons, in 28 years I have seen more bad times and more crap on the pitch than I have seen good, its not just about the standard of football, its about being took for f**king mugs and having the absolute piss took out of you, never has there been a time I have felt so distant, disillusioned and disenfranchised from our club. Something about them just does not feel right anymore, something there is very wrong. A crap team and crap football I can take, seen enough down the years to get through that. There is a toxic atmosphere throughout this club, it is poorly run, too many people at this club are stuck up their own ass, they think their way is right when it clearly isnt and by the looks of it they will cling on to what position they have and put their own needs ahead of TUFC's needs.

Still think the prices are too high, we will never attract new support now, you can all tell me how we need to charge more to compete, money guarantees nothing, even if we could charge £50 a game and we were loaded I still wouldnt trust those running the club to do whats best and bring us success. What is on offer for what the ticket prices are and at the level we are at is scandalous.

Post by **MidDevon** » 22 May 2015, 19:31

I will not stop supporting, just be more selective when I go and when I do not.

I do feel the prices are far too high, could not give two hoots to be honest if we are the cheapest in the conference, it's still crap value for the level of football, in all honestly last year I resented the club were full time, the vast majority of players (not all but the vast majority) were not, IMO, good enough to be earning a full time wage, supplemented in part by mugs like me.

I would rather us be part time, near the lower end of the conference table until we get ourselves sorted.

I've seen the club as far away as Barrow and Morecambe and Darlington...I've done York City twice midweek, I know what supporting a club like Torquay is all about, so don't need a lecture about that.

I suppose I have got older and wiser, I have more money, but less time and the thought of going to Paris or Amsterdam or The Isle of Man for a weekend will sometimes be more appealing

The directors have called this one wrong in my opinion, that appears not to be the opinion of most which is fair enough, but I strongly feel that the average gate next season will be under 1800.

Neal · Post by **Neal** » 23 May 2015, 09:06

Modgull wrote:I remain concerned for the future of the Club despite Thea's generosity in leaving us debt-free. It's a simple question of maths.

If you want a squad of, let's say, 18 pros and 4 emerging youth players then an average wage of around £500 pw for the senior players will give you room for an experienced spine to the team costing £700 - £800 pw as long as you can attract other, decent players at £300 pw for the rest of the team. Let's be clear that this will not necessarily be a squad of league winners - these are not by any means overinflated wages for the Conference.

The cost of this team is around £530,000 including the younger players and employers costs.

Let's say the cost of the manager, assistant, goalkeeping coach, physio etc is another £130,000 including on-costs

Many members of this forum refer to an overblown back office staff but I know from experience that there is no fat in the overheads for running the Club - the academy and FITC sections very much pay for themselves with help from sponsorship. The cost of the overheads - administration, grounds staff, cleaning and maintenance, heating, electricity, rents, insurances, licenses, travel and other match day costs could easily top £300,000.

I know there is income from the various franchises - the Club shop, Boots and Laces rent, the catering outlets, mobile phone masts etc and profit from the Gulls Nest and No 10s restaurant - perhaps £100,000 pa.

So the annual cost of Conference football might be in the region of £860,000

If the average entry price for the 23 home games is £15 (it might well be less, especially since I don't know how VAT is accounted for) then we would require an average gate of 2,500 just to break even. If the average gate dropped to 1,800 (not unreasonable given the second half of last season) then the Club would make a loss of £241,000.

So those people who call for a further reduction in ticket prices as a condition of supporting the Club are just making the job of putting a competitive squad together even less likely with the self-fulfilling prophesy of falling gates and, yes, further financial losses. What this does show, however, is that running a modern football club at this level is a form of economic madness. We should all be grateful that there are people wanting to do this and take the financial risk so we can watch what I believe is still a good standard of football.

Well put! Might make some realise the actual financial situation and that "if you have the club at heart" yeah right, then 1 or 2 pounds extra is probably a lifeline at this moment in time and could make the difference in the quality we might be bale to attract.

Football fans and its not restricted to us actually want to pay less and expect more, DONT HAPPEN!!

Post by **MidDevon** » 23 May 2015, 09:43

The club have to pay VAT on ticket prices at 20%

So for every £10 the club take on the turnstiles, they receive £8.33

Obviously they can off-set some of that charge against their expenses and purchases

Burnhamgull · Post by **Burnhamgull** » 23 May 2015, 10:17

MidDevon is right, choosing not to buy a ST doesn't mean you don't support the club. After the last couple of years, supporters are quite right to think twice about handing over £300 for a ST that gives you nothing but suffering. I don't even know why they put vouchers A-J in the book, we only used a couple last year for free programmes!

I also won't be renewing but that doesn't mean I won't look out for the result. I'm still a member of the TUST and will still attend certain games and the odd away match.

We all have a right to choose what we do on a Saturday afternoon and if sales are down, the club only have themselves to blame.

Modgull · Post by **Modgull** » 23 May 2015, 13:37

Well I hope Burnham and MidDevon are not representative of the rest of the 900 or so season ticket holders from last year.

If they are, then EITHER the Board needs to slash the playing budget and get rid of part of the football management team (as I said before there is no room for any more savings in the back office) OR they will have to take a risk that they will make a serious loss in the current financial year, perhaps rendering the Club insolvent.

Much as I applaud those who are committing £24 pa to the TUST, this is not going to address the fundamental issues which I have referred to previously. We need people to support TUST AND the Club!

frenchgull · Post by **frenchgull** » 23 May 2015, 15:05

Well Burnham and Middevon have made me feel very sad , by not going to matches you are not giving the entrance money and therefore not supporting the TEAM.I agree that the club has been run appallingly with so many mistakes on and off the field but without hardcore support there will not be a Torquay United as we know it.If you feel that you can not go on because you don't think that its value for money then fair enough but there are so many things in this world that are not value for money but I don't love them but your home town football club is something different.

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