Hillsborough Verdicts

[yellowforever]

David Duckenfield faces Hillsborough charges with five others

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-me ... e-40419819

[SuperNickyWroe]

Should be more than six...

[EmetEdadsBeard]

Absolute b0ll0cks. Without this they've no one to claim compo off. Nothing will bring the dead back so why have we had 28 years of it being rammed down our throats, they just wont let it rest.
Ever noticed that Valley Parade, Ibrox and more notably Heysel are rarely mentioned? No second enquiries, no Justice campaign, no decades of looking for a body to blame.
Wonder what would happen if the Heysel victims families sued Victimpool FC for the behaviour of their fans?

[yellowforever]

Absolute b0ll0cks. Without this they've no one to claim compo off. Nothing will bring the dead back so why have we had 28 years of it being rammed down our throats, they just wont let it rest.
Ever noticed that Valley Parade, Ibrox and more notably Heysel are rarely mentioned? No second enquiries, no Justice campaign, no decades of looking for a body to blame.
Wonder what would happen if the Heysel victims families sued Victimpool FC for the behaviour of their fans?

Good lord...

[EmetEdadsBeard]

Have you read this, from the original 'Hillsborough' thread? http://torquayfans.com/viewtopic.php?f= ... 32#p171132 ?

Try reading the rest of it as well. Then have a think about fan behavior in general at big matches

"Luke, your partners uncle was almost certainly an innocent victim of a set of circumstances that no one could have predicted. There were many factors involved, but what really hacks many, many people off is the absolute total denial that Liverpool fans were in any way to blame for any of the events of that day. Its the opinion of many, many people I know that the justice the families seek begins with the letter 'c'.

Who turned up in their 1000s just before kick off? ( I'll give you a theory as to why that happened shortly).

Who turned up without tickets with a view to forcing their way in (a well known ploy of Liverpool fans way before the Hillsborough disaster and incredibly still going on to this day)?

Who has constantly misinterpreted the 'drunken Liverpool fans were to blame' accusation as it was the 96 who died that were drunk NOT the latecomers who forced a decision on SYP to fatally open an exit gate causing a rush of people into the ground?

And why were the stewards and a police sergeant on duty that day accused of neglect of duty having left their posts in the West Stand only to state in the latest enquiry that they had feared for their own safety due to the threats and general behaviour of the Liverpool fans? Indeed the police sergeant stated they were the worst fans he had ever policed! They were on the stand for one day YES ONE DAY while the policeman in overall charge, David Duckenfield, after admitting he was at fault that day spent over a WEEK giving evidence?

I have many friends who lived in and around the area at the time, and tales of Liverpool fans staggering around so drunk they could barely stand were common, urinating in gardens and being generally totally abusive and obnoxious.

The theory as to why so many of them turned up late came from a work mate of mine. He's a Leeds fan and went to the semi at Hillsborough in 1987, and when passing the ground at about 12-30 that day was ordered, along with his mates to go straight into the ground at the risk of being arrested and missing the game. despite protests they were shepherded in and not allowed to even go to the burger bar across the road. He thinks that if Liverpool fans suffered the same treatment in 1988 (when they also played in the semi at Hillsborough) then they probably avoided the ground until the last minute and stayed in the local pubs (at least one of which was trashed and ransacked with the landlord and his staff having to lock themselves in the living quarters as the Liverpool fans wrecked the place and robbed it of its entire stock), thus turning up late.
The constant misinterpretation of drink causing the 96 deaths really pisses me and many more off as almost certainly the poor buggers who perished were the ones who got in nice and early, got behind a barrier with a good view and were consequently crushed by the drunken latecomers. Unfortunately that possibility is never mentioned as we all know Liverpool fans are all angels and are 0% to blame for anything (even Heysel, ironically one of the reasons fences were erected in the first place!).

While feeling desperately sorry for the people who lost loved ones, the Justice campaigns total rejection of any blame whatsoever being laid at their own fans door has alienated them from many people.
The Police weren't forcing people into the ground. The stewards weren't forcing people into the ground, neither were Sheffield Wednesday or the FA's Officials.

As for Hillsborough and many other grounds being safer now they're all seats, which clubs fans (admittedly along with others) stand at away fixtures without exception, yet shout the loudest against the return of standing at football?
Have
What is going to happen if the inquest returns a verdict of accidental death or misadventure? Are the Justice campaign going to demand another enquiry until they get the verdict they crave?

There has been other disasters at sporting events, Bradford, Ibrox, Heysel, yet only Hillsborough has dragged on and on through the courts.

The cynic in me wonders why?"

When you think beyond the media crapping themselves because of the myth that ALL Liverpool fans are ALL totally innocent and ALL turned up with tickets, in plenty of time and formed an orderly queue then you may realise that the one of the biggest cover ups is the behaviour of the media's favourites, those jolly Scousers.
Until then the comment 'Good Lord' is worthless.

[merse btpir]

almost certainly the poor buggers who perished were the ones who got in nice and early, got behind a barrier with a good view and were consequently crushed by the drunken latecomers.

That and memories of 'Heysel' have always been at the forefront of my thinking on this terrible tragedy. It almost certainly was the innocent who perished but then you have to hold a to account all the other people and factors that cost them their lives.

It is wrong that lies and cover ups have been used by the Establishment to absolve themselves from accountability and it is right that the common man can take on the Establishment and prevail and it is a bloody scandal that it has taken 28 years to get to this stage of the proceedings.

I have witnessed the bullying and belligerence of people forcing themselves into an event on more than one occasion and have sympathy with those charged with keeping order; but I have also experienced the ignorance and insensitivity of the South Yorkshire Police Force when visiting Hillsborough with Torquay United when we played there in the FA Cup and when recalling their delusion of being a paramilitary force at Orgreave in 1984.

[yellowforever]

Am I missing something here? The fans have been completely exonerated. The inquests, through painstaking inquiry have found that the actions of the fans had nothing to do with the outcome. Absolutely nothing.

The "good lord" was in reference to your completely ignorant view of the situation.

[yellowforever]

When you think beyond the media crapping themselves because of the myth that ALL Liverpool fans are ALL totally innocent and ALL turned up with tickets, in plenty of time and formed an orderly queue then you may realise that the one of the biggest cover ups is the behaviour of [highlight=yellow]the media's favourites, those jolly Scousers.[/highlight]

This is the bit that got me, you have to be a parody account right?

[Southampton Gull]

He's far from ignorant and has a lot more experience of how Liverpool fans acted then and still act now.

[merse btpir]

EmetEdadsBeard posts from the perspective of being a life-long Sheffield Wednesday supporter; they have been the innocent 'victims' of Hillsborough with over a quarter of a century of stigma, lack of investment and prejudice in their stadium.

At the same time the people of South Yorkshire and it's mining and steelmaking community have lived under the most shameful Conservative instigated social destruction, and politically bigoted police force it is possible to imagine.

Justice for the 96, the fans of Sheffield Wednesday and the people of South Yorkshire!

[EmetEdadsBeard]

Thanks Dave, and Merse, the problem with so many people is they believe everything that the second enquiry, the Justice campaign and the sychopnantic media say about Liverpool fans.
Yellowforever is one of these people. If the SECOND (brought about because they didn't get the verdict they wanted from the first one!) had said all Liverpool fans are tee total God fearing church goers they would agree and say it must be right.
Yellowforever, when you have first hand dealings with those 'Jolly Scousers', particularly if your club has just beaten them at Anfield then you might just look at them in a different light. Why not try getting a ticket to a Liverpool away match next season and sit (oh wait a minute, despite being the loudest voices shouting against the return to standing at games, they are the worst culprits for doing just that!) among'st them. They aren't the sweetness and light you seem to believe they are.

I repeat, one of the biggest cover ups concerning the Hillsborough disaster was the behaviour of a considerable number of Liverpool fans that day, but as criticising them isn't allowed, I really hope during the trial of the six concerned video footage and testimony as to this behaviour is allowed to be used as evidence in court.
The cynic in me thinks it will not though.

[Southampton Gull]

My personal view is that this tragedy happened not only due to mistakes made by those in authority but ALSO the behaviour of a small number of fans . Why are we supposed to believe that for this one particular game they broke the habit of a lifetime and didn't try forcing their way in without a ticket? I've been caught up in their tactics when they tried to get into the away end at The Dell but went through the wrong gate and ended up in the Southampton fans side. They weren't looking for trouble just once again bursting through a gate for free. They did the same thing throughout their European campaign.

Yes the fans were exonerated publicly BUT I find it incredible that this was one game where this tactic of theirs supposedly didn't happen.