Torquay United v Southend United - 17/11/12

[The Farmers Friend]

We don't play on tuesday mate.

Oh, that's really arsed up my week! Cheers for the reminder...

[Yellowledbetter]

Just thought i'd listen to Lings post match comments...'we may bring in a loan centre half'...I nearly threw the laptop out of the window. Is it just the fans that can see we need another striker or somebody that can create something?!

[Dave_Pougher]

@Forever: I agree Dave, it'd be nice to get a loanee in to shake things up but I really don't think there is room for it in the budget, from what I was told today anyway. The club really weren't happy at the attendance for the cup game (unsurprising at it was full price!) but yeah, we aren't making money at the moment. There's always the possibility of a free 'loanee' if you like, but I think our location goes against us there.

@Chris: Yep, I'll accept it. I think we're at our level to be totally honest, the odd flutter into League One or maybe even 'do a Colchester' and have a year in the Championship once in a while (though I know we haven't, but we've been close!). League 2 is our level at the moment, you look and see sides like Shrewsbury who dominated this division in the bottom 4 and think if we had gone up, we'd probably end up straight back down here again.

As for Rene, yes I'm pretty confident he'll go on, we won't get any money for the guy but I also think he's probably our highest earner, so we'll no doubt go back to the drawing board. The answer certainly isn't in the building for that one though, so hopefully he goes in the summer where we have time to replace him.

Nothing against you Nick but FECKIN HELL what did they expect ? I was undecided about attending both the cup and yesterdays game. But after spending a fortune at the Rovers match I attended neither. I am now about £200 better off after not making the effort taking my family to two dissapointing results. Simples !!

[Plymouth Gull]

Exactly Dave. I wasn't surprised to see the attendance fall below 2000 for it, it was foolish keeping the price the same.

[brucie]

Thats exactly it - it cost me the best part of £60 to attend yesterdays game. The crowd of 2400 wasn't too bad considering recent terrible results.
However it isn't really worth turning up. Rice might be a good bloke but he just isn't a pro keeper. He clearly lost his confidence after the first goal went straight through his legs and after that was awful.
Not the rest of the team were much cop either. Southend were actualy average though but we made them look like Brazil.
I just don't see the point in marooning Howe up front by himself. Thompson might be young but he is better than anything else we have wide so why the hell does Ling play Craig there.
Elliot Benyon cannot even get on the Southend bench and would be ideal playing alongside Howe - if we want a loan signing there is the answer.
With Bodin and Thompson out wide we clearly have the personnel to worry defences - even Jarvis is an option in a 4-4-2.
But we have to go 3-0 down before we line up like this - Ling is looking more and more like a one trick pony with no plan b.

[shaunicus]

Poor yesterday, but I'm sorry, but I don't subscribe to the notion we're suddenly in crisis. Think it was a freak result, one that happens every now and then when you face a good team with a big budget like Southend, and though we're in a bit of a rut at the moment we'll ultimately be fine.

Don't think wholesale changes are required - just a couple of tweaks. I can see the logic in putting Craig out wide with his crossing but he'd be much more effective in the middle, getting on the ball and starting attacks. Get Stevens or Thompson out wide so we've got pace on the flanks, Lathrope gives us the insurance policy, Manse can go box to box. Simple. Good players at this level playing in their correct positions. We don't need to go changing systems or doing anything drastic, this is, on the most part, the same team and system that took us to the playoffs last season, and currently has us sitting comfortably in mid-table.

I think we've almost become a victim of our own success. Reaching the playoffs two years in a row have risen expectations and perhaps unfairly so. Now, not for one moment am I suggesting we shouldn't aim for that, we should aim to win every single game, but finances and budget would suggest consolidation is about right for us, and I'd be happy with a mid-table finish.

Would I like us to bring in a couple of players? Absolutely. Can we afford anyone? Unless it's an emergency, probably not. That's the harsh reality of where we are.

One final note - Southend had Barry Corr and Freddy Eastwood sitting on the bench yesterday. Elliot Benyon didn't even make the matchday squad. Goes to show the gulf in finances, and what we're sometimes up against in this division.

[AustrianAndyGull]

So we accept we have an inferior side so that is a reason not to attack then? You could have 11 dwarfes on the pitch but if you set them out in the right manner anything can be achieved. Listen, Southend are not Man Utd so why play against them ( and most other teams we have played this season ) in the same way we would if we went to Old Trafford. By planning to not get beaten and showing no ambition. I don't understand what is so difficult for some of you to grasp, we have a half decent squad but we play sh*te football every week. That is my problem. Not that Bodin can't finish or that Jarvo doesn't do anything or this, that and the other. Moaning about what you haven't got is pointless and pathetic, use what you HAVE got wisely. Tell me this then, especially for the away regulars. If Martin was to remain at Plainmoor for the next 10 years deploying the same style of football and the same performances every week and we finish mid table ish most of the time, are you telling me you would be happy with this and you wouldn't choose to not go to some games on the basis of 'can't be bothered coz it's boring' ? That is now what people are accepting, that we aren't quite good enough and and we are treated to turgid football all the f*cking time too. Will that be enough for you in 10 years? This is Ling and this is what he will offer Torquay for theforseeable.

Say what you like about Paul Buckle. At least he had confidence in his own abilities and some ambition.

Lingy is a 'see what happens' type of manager instead of trying to make things happen. I can do that, put 11 out there and see what happens.

[Kernowgull]

Shaunicus- you say we cant afford to bring in a loan signing, thats the harsh reality of where we are.

I agree, but what a lot of people are struggling tl accept, isnt that we've no budget, its that there is talk of bringing in a defender on loan, when it is so clear this is not what we need.

I am still positive that we will not be in any trouble this year, but I am starting to agree with others. Weve got 1 point from the last three games, plus lost in the cup. If we'd really gone for it, we may have won one of those games, and we'd be better off for it. Negative tactics can only be tolerated when yielding results.

[wivelgull]

I agree with Brucie. Why should I make a 100 mole round trip to be offered such boring and tedious football - not once, but over and over and over again? I saw the infamous Coombe match (we lost 0-4 to Exeter) and Rice was not much better yesterday. He couldn't have been worse than Coombe, of course, but it was pretty dire. I certainly won't be coming to the next home match, or the next, or the next unless the product improves.
To those who attend away matches: if the stuff you're watching away from home is as bad as that on offer at home, then you have my understanding and commiserations.

[brucie]

You are not going to win football matches playing an amateur goal keeper in a professional football team. Rice might be cheap but what is the point of paying him a regular salary when he is incapable of doing the job for which he is paid when required.
However bad we were yesterday we would have at least ended up with a 1-1 draw had we paraded a half decent keeper.
We have a shed load of players who are not good enough - Rice,Halpin,Yeoman,Easton,Cruise - there are five we could get rid of tomorrow.
Perhaps then we could get in one or two players who could actually contribute something to the first team.
Goodness knows how we have managed to stay in the top half of the table when the majority of our peformances are just awful.
The Barnet and Harrogate results were no fluke though and an indication of where we are heading - and thats bottomn half for certain.

[AustrianAndyGull]

Brucie i do think you are being unfair on Ricey, i've not seen how he has done since coming in but to lay most of the blame for the defeat on him isn't right. Given the way we played yet again, even if we had Pokey in goal and scraped a 1-1 the same old inadequacies in Lings management style occured, ie ultra defensive negative bullsh*t. So even if we had got a 1-1 draw i wouldn't have been any happier. If we had gone down 3-1 giving it a real go from the off then i can accept that.

Of the players you have mentioned Rice, i can't comment on as i haven't seen him play. Halpin and Cruise DEFINATELY are nowhere near good enough. Halpin has been with us since he was a foetus and is still no closer to any decent first team action so why keep him? Easton the jury is out and Yeoman hasn't had enough games for me to make a decision although i'd prefer him to be given a decent runout.

Agree 100%, we are heading downwards and just like i predicted a right hammering yesterday and people thought i was just being negative again ( not saying that to prove a point and try to make myself look good because i don't do cocky - i just do say as i find) and what i have found looking at us as the season has progressed is we are 85% of the time totally abhorrent to watch. The excuses are now flooding out and we're in for a bit of a rocky ride. Just as the Southend game last season kick started our season, the Southend defeat yesterday will have the opposite effect. In his time at Cambridge, Ling resorted to lumping the ball up to a big man so say many of their fans, the football became mind-numbing and with no endeavour or ability to change this. We are getting that now and it is more predictable than that Corrie bird in I'm a Celebrity refusing to do a bushtucker trial. We won't go down because his method of playing will accumulate enough points to keep us comfortable but if you want to continue contributing to a mans wage packet when he hasn't done much this season other than turn up for work and chuck 11 players out there every week hoping for the best then be my guest. In actual fact it is Rene Howe who should get half because without his goals the table would look very unpleasant.

[Modgull]

It is crazy to blame Rice for yesterday's defeat. There were NO acceptable performances by the starting 11 so don't start demonising Rice.

And the team was set up totally wrong by the manager. I couldn't believe it when I arrived for the match - TWO holding midfield players for a home game! And our most creative player (Craig) marooned wide up front in a so-called 433 formation!

By sticking to 433 with Craig and Bodin too far away to support Howe and the midfield overrun by Southend's mid four we again reverted to something more akin to 451 - AT HOME!!!

Because he got no support and because Cresswell was outstanding, Howe was totally nullified and I don't believe he even had an attempt on goal!

Not that anyone else did much better - four attempts and two on target over 90 minutes at home says it all.

Ling tried to make amends at half time by going to a proper 442 with Jarvis alongside Howe but the game was already lost and things became worse when we went four down.

However, the introduction of a proper, pacey winger in Thompson with Jarvis did produce a good goal and we might have scored again if Mansell had not produced a shocking tackle which rightly resulted in a red card and summed up his entire start to the current season.

From then on it was damage limitation.

Ling needs to realise that he does not have the players to make 433 work. We need to move to 442, at least at home, and he needs to accommodate Craig in midfield with pace on the wings. Unfortunately that means no space for either Mansell or Lathrope but at least that problem has been solved for the next three games by Mansell's suspension.

And plan B for away games could be 4411 with Jarvis on the bench, Craig playing in the hole (a la O'Kane last season) and Mansell (Easton whilst he serves his suspension) in midfield.

Can't believe Ling is looking at a CB loan signing! It is in midfield where we have our problems!

[brucie]

All that is fair comment completely - the formation is ridiculous. Craig is no winger (he is in fact overated anyway, but isn't bad) but as you say Bodin is completely nullified as they are playing far to far away from the central striker.
Easton is just hopeless and might as well be paid off now.
However it doesn't alter the fact that three of their goals were errors by Rice.
The first one was a soft shot let through his legs - he dived too early.
The third one went right across his goaline - he did absolutely nothing.
The fourth goal was absolutely pathetic - he had ample time to come out and clear the ball but instead hesitated - he was hopeless he did not have a clue what to do.
The problem is that he was basically frozen on his line for the whole ninety minutes - even their disallowed goal was the same - he just stood there rooted to his goaline.
I am sorry he is just a liability - he would not get a sniff at any other football league club because he is an amateur.
You could perhaps not blame the ten outfield players for giving up watching that debacle.

[yellowmonkey]

All i can say is OOOPPPSSSS!!!! And hopefully we are not about to enter a relegation fight.

[yellow]

Just seen the lowlights on TFLS.

Surely the problem is that we were wearing the wrong coloured socks..?