Boardroom, Who does what?

Post by **Southampton Gull** » 08 May 2014, 21:27

None so blind as those that won't see.

I'm beginning to think that the ignorance shown by a lot of fans has resulted in them getting exactly what they deserve. There's enough facts on this thread, ignore them if you wish, no skin off my nose.

hector · Post by **hector** » 08 May 2014, 23:30

Southampton Gull wrote:None so blind as those that won't see.

I'm beginning to think that the ignorance shown by a lot of fans has resulted in them getting exactly what they deserve. There's enough facts on this thread, ignore them if you wish, no skin off my nose.

What are the 'facts'? A lot of conjecture, rhetoric but nothing factual or evidence based as of yet. I'm happy to be proven incorrect but why doesn't someone, maybe you, spell it out rather than hiding behind innuendo and hints that they know things others do not and that, that should be enough to prove a point.

Post by **Southampton Gull** » 08 May 2014, 23:46

I've not hidden behind anything. I've spelled it out as simply as I can. You carry on believing in those nice fellows...........

tomogull · Post by **tomogull** » 09 May 2014, 00:37

Southampton Gull wrote:None so blind as those that won't see.

I'm beginning to think that the ignorance shown by a lot of fans has resulted in them getting exactly what they deserve. There's enough facts on this thread, ignore them if you wish, no skin off my nose.

SG - I take notice of your posts more than most other posts. I have ploughed my way back to the first posting on this thread and although there are several sensible postings, there are precious few facts. I admit to being ignorant about how the club is run and who does what, or who does not, but that is because information provided by the Board is minimal. If you know 'facts', please spill the beans ! However, I realise you have to be careful not to leave yourself open to libel (or is it slander? - I never remember which is which). In an early posting, you wrote ''some of the Board have had their hands tied by Baker and Phillips for quite some time'. How and why ??

Going off on another tack, someone asked Andrew Candy on his thread if a Fans Forum could be arranged with Thea, Chris H and some of the Board members. I think this is an excellent suggestion. It remains to be seen if it will be taken up ....... It does seem to me that there is now a gulf between the fans and the Board simply because so little information is forthcoming from the Board.

hector · Post by **hector** » 09 May 2014, 06:52

tomogull wrote: SG - I take notice of your posts more than most other posts. I have ploughed my way back to the first posting on this thread and although there are several sensible postings, there are precious few facts. I admit to being ignorant about how the club is run and who does what, or who does not, but that is because information provided by the Board is minimal. If you know 'facts', please spill the beans ! However, I realise you have to be careful not to leave yourself open to libel (or is it slander? - I never remember which is which). In an early posting, you wrote ''some of the Board have had their hands tied by Baker and Phillips for quite some time'. How and why ??

Going off on another tack, someone asked Andrew Candy on his thread if a Fans Forum could be arranged with Thea, Chris H and some of the Board members. I think this is an excellent suggestion. It remains to be seen if it will be taken up ....... It does seem to me that there is now a gulf between the fans and the Board simply because so little information is forthcoming from the Board.

If it is 'factual' with evidence to support the assertion, then SG wouldn't be leaving himself open to slander or libel. All we get instead is 'Baker doesn't want promotion', 'Baker and Phillips cut the budget while the rest of the board were helpless onlookers', 'Baker and Phillips messed up'.

I'm not saying that I 'believe in' Baker or Phillips, but in the entire time they have been being slagged off, I have still not read anything that actually, clearly explains what they have done wrong - and it would seem I am not the only one who feels this way.

SG, DTG, etc, may well be correct but I would just like to be privy to these facts as well. I'm not just going to take their word for it.

DTG · Post by **DTG** » 09 May 2014, 07:30

Steve, what you're asking is very hard to provide short of a signed confession from Baker and video evidence of Phillips management style along with recordings of meetings. Ask yourself what Division we're now in and how we got there. Is the Plainmoor matchday experience better or worse than say 10 years ago? Have the Board grown the Customer base in any way, shape or form? Is TUFC perceived as a professionally run Football club? Have additional revenue streams been saught, developed and exploited? As an employer are TUFC regarded as a fair, responsible and desirable Company to work for? Do the Board keep their word? Have the Board attracted new Investment? I know this is not the response you want but on the balance of probabilities who are you more inclined to believe?

BTW, this is not a bandwagon I've suddenly decided to jump on. I've been pointing this out for several years.

gullintwoplaces · Post by **gullintwoplaces** » 09 May 2014, 08:02

Can't comment of who says or does what at the Board, as I am not an "insider". Of all the things talked about above there are some clear facts however.

Firstly, the decision to allow Buckle to talk to Bristol Rovers in the week leading up to our playoff final at Old Trafford was a poor one to put it mildly. I went to Manchester full of expectation, stayed the night and felt very angry after the game. I always blamed three people for this: Buckle, the Rovers Chairman (who I cursed that evening and, although I wish no ill on Rovers as a club, i am pleased to see Mr Higgs with many eggs on his face this season) and, not least, the person on the Torquay Board who allowed Buckle to talk to Rovers. Some of the above comments deal well with the last of those three. Why he allowed Buckle to talk to Higgs I cannot say, that would be conjecture.

Second, the management appointments and sackings, which have come over as amateurish and poorly handled. Yes, I know that fans have asked for this and that, but the Board are paid to lead the club well and do what is best for the club. What the fans want is often just a passing fancy.

Third, investment in the team has not been timely. It may have been forthcoming when the brown stuff hits the fan, but it has not been timely. Ling above all suffered from this.

Can't comment on any other facts, as I don't know what they are!

Kernowgull · Post by **Kernowgull** » 09 May 2014, 08:31

Whilst these are bordering facts, none of them answer the question of why Phillips and Baker are to blame. I can't believe 2 board members can overrule 10 others, unless they have some lurid pictures of other board members!

budleigh · Post by **budleigh** » 09 May 2014, 08:39

Going off on another tack, someone asked Andrew Candy on his thread if a Fans Forum could be arranged with Thea, Chris H and some of the Board members.

My understanding is that this is all in hand and is just a case of a suitable date being arranged.

DTG · Post by **DTG** » 09 May 2014, 08:45

If a ship hits the rocks, who is to blame? If a Company fails, who is to blame? If you keep repeating the same behaviour and keep getting the same outcome, who is to blame? It's the person in charge, that would be Baker and/or Phillips. The FACT that we are NON-LEAGUE would indicate that those in charge (Baker and/or Phillips) got something a bit wrong. It is the FACT we are where we are that convicts Baker and/or Phillips. Let's put the blame/credit boot on the other foot for a moment. Who do you think would be preening, posing and self back slapping if we'd just been promoted? If you're there to take the credit for good performance you should also be held responsible for downright shit performance. Do you think for one nanosecond that Baker and/or Phillips would have thrust Thea into the frontline if they weren't fully aware that a large pile of shit was heading their way? They are Cowards as well as useless.

Jerry · Post by **Jerry** » 09 May 2014, 09:33

DTG wrote:If a ship hits the rocks, who is to blame? If a Company fails, who is to blame? If you keep repeating the same behaviour and keep getting the same outcome, who is to blame? It's the person in charge, that would be Baker and/or Phillips. The FACT that we are NON-LEAGUE would indicate that those in charge (Baker and/or Phillips) got something a bit wrong. It is the FACT we are where we are that convicts Baker and/or Phillips. Let's put the blame/credit boot on the other foot for a moment. Who do you think would be preening, posing and self back slapping if we'd just been promoted? If you're there to take the credit for good performance you should also be held responsible for downright sh*t performance. Do you think for one nanosecond that Baker and/or Phillips would have thrust Thea into the frontline if they weren't fully aware that a large pile of sh*t was heading their way? They are Cowards as well as useless.

I think this is where the confusion is arising.

I didn't think that anybody was "in charge" as such. I thought the board was supposed to be a democracy and that the Chairman was really just a spokesman for the rest of them.

cambgull · Post by **cambgull** » 09 May 2014, 09:52

So what are Baker's and Phillips' actual roles within the board?

I just find it hard to believe that 2 people can gain so much favour and power over a board. If that is the case, then the fault should lie with every other board member for letting them get away with it.

Through connections, I know a couple members of the board and although I don't know them massively well, I know them well enough to judge character. They are the more silent partners but they aren't the type to suffer fools gladly. If they had a problem with Baker and Phillips, you'd soon find them forcing the hand of Thea by pulling out their funding unless the disease had been removed. That's why I don't believe the fault of everything is entirely at the feet of 2 out of 12/13 people.

Kernowgull · Post by **Kernowgull** » 09 May 2014, 09:59

I agree with Cambgull. I am not in anyway suggesting the board haven't made huge mistakes, I just don't know and can't see what these two particular board members have done more than the rest. There have been no facts written about this, just repeated blame.

DTG · Post by **DTG** » 09 May 2014, 11:04

Kernowgull wrote:I agree with Cambgull. I am not in anyway suggesting the board haven't made huge mistakes, I just don't know and can't see what these two particular board members have done more than the rest. There have been no facts written about this, just repeated blame.

I'm sorry guys, how can you not know? We've just been relegated to the Conference in case it slipped by you. The "two particular board members" were driving the bus over the cliff while the other passengers looked on. Who would you regard as responsible, the drivers, passengers or both equally?

cambgull · Post by **cambgull** » 09 May 2014, 12:56

DTG wrote: I'm sorry guys, how can you not know? We've just been relegated to the Conference in case it slipped by you. The "two particular board members" were driving the bus over the cliff while the other passengers looked on. Who would you regard as responsible, the drivers, passengers or both equally?

But all we're being presented with is, 'well, they did it' and that's the entirety of your argument. And saying "We've just been relegated" isn't proof either, it just proves that we've been relegated, it doesn't prove that the blame should be entirely at the feet of two board members that no one seems to know anything about.

I'm sure you and SG are completely correct in what you're saying, but we can't just believe what you're saying based on ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF WHATSOEVER. You have to remember that many of us don't have close contact with board members or people within the club, we don't get the opinions of the people who see things first hand so we have no idea what goes on behind closed doors in the Boardroom. For us, as a jury of their peers, it's the equivalent of going into the courtroom as the prosecution opens their case with, "He's a rapist and he raped this poor girl here. Look, she's in tears... I rest my case." The defence might well be the rapist, but if your entire case is based on, "he did it" then it'll get thrown out of court ridiculously quickly.

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