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jarvis has been a differant player since ak took over, i was one of his worse critics and i have to say he has come good and he has proved me wrong, labadie and chapple have been great signings, billy is starting to look like the player we knew he was and im sure that next season we will beat a hard side to beat if we can sign these sort of players even on season long loans if need be, and what an atmosphere in the last two games, the fans have done there bit to, see what happens when the team starts producing results and decent football.

Dutchgull, in typically gutless fashion, PM'd this:

Arrogant as ever "Matt" I was just quoting what I was told by a board member if you don't to believe its no odds to me. Perhaps you are not as knowledgeable as you think you are...........Dutchgull Posts: 443Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 1:15 pm

For a start, sweetheart, Matt needn't go in quotation marks, it's my name, not a pseudonym. Secondly, there is a banner displayed at Old Trafford which reads "Manchester United, not arrogant, just better". See where I'm going with this?
And finally (read it in Trevor McDonald's voice), everyone on here hears 'something from a Board member'. A) it's mostly crap and B) if it's not crap, I can't think of a single reason the Board would offer propoganda in this respect, can you?

I wish I was dumb enough to just believe everything I was told without thinking, life must seem so straight forward.

"Matt"

Why do you feel the need to post something from a pm - nobody is interested actually.

Looking on the tv I thought the red card was debatable - there were three other defenders in a line with Cruise. The ref couldn't wait to send him off though - he gave York everything.

Yeah, I thought the same about the red card Brucie. He didn't appear to be the last defender and it was, in my opinion (and clearly yours!!), a harsh red card.

Nick or Ryan will soon correct me if I am wrong, but I allways thought a red card was issued if a clear goal scoring opportunity was denied, as it looked from where I was standing, as said I have not seen it back on t.v yet, as if the player was about to get a shot off, in which case to me a clear goalscoring opportunity was denied and the red card would be correct.

Exactly why I felt it was a red. Cruise was unlucky in so far as he caught him totally by accident as he cut back but definitely denied a clear goalscoring opportunity.

http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/8 ... y-2-1-york

Penalty about 1:18

Blatant shove in the back. Clear penalty and red card. Funny how things appear so different at the time but no argument, the ref made the right call.

brucie wrote:Why do you feel the need to post something from a pm - nobody is interested actually.

Looking on the tv I thought the red card was debatable - there were three other defenders in a line with Cruise. The ref couldn't wait to send him off though - he gave York everything.

Taken a poll of everyone on the planet, I take it?

Matt.

Just seen the pen. Doesnt look like a red to me. Player went down very easy, Cruise shoulder barge probably mistimed but the player is very wide and would not have scored IMO

Kernowgull wrote:Just seen the pen. Doesnt look like a red to me. Player went down very easy, Cruise shoulder barge probably mistimed but the player is very wide and would not have scored IMO

It's the denying of the opportunity, regardless of how viable that opportunity is (within reason) which constitutes the red card element of the offence. It's a daft rule, because they get the goal anyway, but it's a rule of which Tom was aware none-the-less.

Matt.

Thanks for putting that video up Scott, it is simple was goal scoring opportunity denied, not would he have scored or where another defender is positioned.

Looking at that video the York lad is clearly fouled and would have had a clear shot off on goal, so a goalscoring opportunity was denied, referee has got it spot on, was stood with SG and a few others Saturday we all believed at the time the ref had it right, and that video for me proves it.

Denial of a clear goal scoring opportunity, red card.
It did appear to be just very clumsy from Cruise, Hopefully the disciplinary panel will take this in to account and see there was no malice and only give a one game ban.

It's a statutory one gamer anyway. Can't be doing with finding the relevant link now, but bans are dictated by the offence, not the severity. There are, of course, situations where this isn't the case, but this isn't one of them.

Matt.

In my opinion, poke was rushing out so this decision for a red card was a very tight one. Cruise did intentionally push him over but it all depends if cruise was "the 2nd last defender" as its officially known. (poke being classed as the last defender). If he was deemed to be then there is no choice- which I think he was; just, if you look at who's covering. imagine without cruise being there, who would be the next defender and where is he placed (McDonald?) - the attacker is ahead of him.