Think Louis meant the snap general election called today.
Candidate may welcome a cause that cements their local connections.
Guardian Article On Torquay
TUST number 080
-
Glostergull
- Country Captain
- Posts: 3553
- Joined: 18 Sep 2010, 17:29
- Favourite player: ROBIN STUBBS
- Location: Gloucester
I know many were not of the opinion that GI were not good for us. But I have been in the opposition camp firmly and decidedly. right from day one.
Some of you know I was involved with Bristol Rovers board way back in the early days of GI who were known better as Bristol Stadium ltd then Stadia UK. There was a very dubious fire at Eastville which was possibly started deliberately but we will never know. The Owners had the opportunity and moral obligation to rebuild the stand, but instead took the money to line their own pockets. they then decided to increase the rent way above what Rovers could afford with far less facilities than before and the crowd safety certificate reduced to only 5000. Rovers were left with no option but to leave or they would have gone the way of Coventry City. Gi then finished the greyhound racing and developed the ground into a shopping area. Ikea now sits where the pitch used to be. They moved onto Reading and Swindon.
The whole sorry saga at Swindon looked as if it might be drawing to a conclusion when the new stadium was supposedly started way back last year. ooh no, it seems as if something else has held it up. nothing of note has shown any real concerted effort in real concrete construction as of yet. it was supposed to be ready to host races in the next month. but it isn't going to happen.
Reading. Well what can I say. It doesn't take a genius. ( my mate says that should be GEN I US) to see what the real intention of GI is. They redeveloped the arena but the speedway team has been wound up. its no more. its gone to meet the speedway team in the sky. its driving up the daisies, Its deceased. it will never race again. is this likely to happen in Torquay. yes. it is. unfortunately like it or not. the Fawlty Towers comedy has come with a price and some do sadly look on Torquay as a sad place and a bit of a joke. It used to be a great place to go for holidays. then when package holidays came about it was still a top spot for days out. But even that has gone by the way what with the problems associated with drink and constant fights on the harbour/strand, Yes, Much has been done to clean up the problem but the damage has been done and it will take a few years before the public really trust the area again. The cruise ships are a real step in the right direction but its a drop in the ocean. some are faced with a spirit of depression which has descended on Torbay to a degree and with the demise of the football club most people who used to go can't be bothered any more. one or two said no one cares. and others retorted back that they do care. But reality bites when the ground is barely a quarter full. apathy is apparent and I have serious doubts that enough people will be bothered even though they say they care. its one thing to say they care about United. But quite another when you ask if they will get off their backsides and get them to do something. Anything. rather than sit in apathy and watch it disappear.
they were involved with the horrendous debacle at Hereford. i won't go into that one. top much is already documented, at least the council stuck to its guns. and now have the new Hereford FC as tenants. Poole town has supposedly been planned for getting a new home. nothing but a pipe dream. ( my computer decided it was going to replace pipe with oboe. Well would it make any difference. You can dream of oboes as well but either way it won't bring about a new stadium).
One or two have commented on here that we should be concentrating on supporting the team right now. and leave the aggro until later. But I contend to you that it will be too late to leave it to the end of the season. The public have to be told now. it will take an awful lot before it filters down to anyone who might do anything about it. its like driving a car. you have to use your indicators to signal your intent well before you want to turn off. not as you turn off.( sorry if i have burst anyones bubbles who drive cars. I was a highly qualified instructor). You can't start to inform people but it takes time before they cotton on how serious the situation is. leave it to the end of the season and it might be too late before people rise up and start to have a go. assuming they can now in their state of apathy.
As one had put it many years ago. THE ONLY HING NECESSARY FOR THE TRIUMPH OF EVIL IS THAT GOOD MEN DO NOTHING. Dave Thomas please note!. to have a position of influence and not use it to investigate the truth is incomprehensible. it does no one any service to make ribald accusations without proof, but it is incumbent upon people who are in a position of power to let it happen without any complaint at all. further it is incumbent upon those in office to act without impropriety and favour to allow something like this to happen behind the publics back as it seems is happening. it smacks of corruption, not necessarily because they have received any bribes, but just through ignorance and lack of due process. the process itself then becomes corrupt. and asks the question of that official whether he or she is then fit for office.
A very great part of the mischiefs that vex the world arises from words. another quote to bear in mind. Words are cheap. words used to deny people due process are poor and corrupt and words used to deceive are evil.
so bearing this in mind. lets use our words carefully and intelligently and aim them like a modern weapon. guided by laser. i.e. they are able to do real damage to those who aim to deceive. backed up with proof where we can and substantial circumstantial evidence if we cannot. don't aim to just fire off with invective. like Someone from the club has done on the OS. that in itself has served to damage their cause and can be used to bring the whole house of cards down. we ,just avoid the temptation to fire back likewise. threats of bad things, violence or criminal activity would undermine our whole cause. we need to go in at them armed with faith in our cause. Truth backed up by evidence and openness and transparency which shows up the other side for what they are. as would self interest. promoting oneself as the self serving saviour or whatever. some can come on as looking to promote how good they look in public. and as a result, end up undermining the message which turns others right off them and the cause as a result. and lets use our words intelligently. clean language that can be directed in the right quarters and unmask the officials who intend to hurt us. So many times a cause has been undermined by foul mouth rants that have given the imression that we are nothing but the usual brush tarred bunch of foul mouthed thugs this is so apparent on pages of Facebook and some of the forums i have witnessed. yes we may be angry. but to vent that anger out in an uncontrolled spew does us no service at all and those in power will just ignore us and think we are worth burying. The OS has shown than words can damage reputations. they did their cause no good at all when venting their criticism. no matter that the individual concerned has a reputation on here for being less than diplomatic. they used a bludgeon where better use of language would have been more useful. But that serves to help our cause. as long as we learn from it.
Some of you know I was involved with Bristol Rovers board way back in the early days of GI who were known better as Bristol Stadium ltd then Stadia UK. There was a very dubious fire at Eastville which was possibly started deliberately but we will never know. The Owners had the opportunity and moral obligation to rebuild the stand, but instead took the money to line their own pockets. they then decided to increase the rent way above what Rovers could afford with far less facilities than before and the crowd safety certificate reduced to only 5000. Rovers were left with no option but to leave or they would have gone the way of Coventry City. Gi then finished the greyhound racing and developed the ground into a shopping area. Ikea now sits where the pitch used to be. They moved onto Reading and Swindon.
The whole sorry saga at Swindon looked as if it might be drawing to a conclusion when the new stadium was supposedly started way back last year. ooh no, it seems as if something else has held it up. nothing of note has shown any real concerted effort in real concrete construction as of yet. it was supposed to be ready to host races in the next month. but it isn't going to happen.
Reading. Well what can I say. It doesn't take a genius. ( my mate says that should be GEN I US) to see what the real intention of GI is. They redeveloped the arena but the speedway team has been wound up. its no more. its gone to meet the speedway team in the sky. its driving up the daisies, Its deceased. it will never race again. is this likely to happen in Torquay. yes. it is. unfortunately like it or not. the Fawlty Towers comedy has come with a price and some do sadly look on Torquay as a sad place and a bit of a joke. It used to be a great place to go for holidays. then when package holidays came about it was still a top spot for days out. But even that has gone by the way what with the problems associated with drink and constant fights on the harbour/strand, Yes, Much has been done to clean up the problem but the damage has been done and it will take a few years before the public really trust the area again. The cruise ships are a real step in the right direction but its a drop in the ocean. some are faced with a spirit of depression which has descended on Torbay to a degree and with the demise of the football club most people who used to go can't be bothered any more. one or two said no one cares. and others retorted back that they do care. But reality bites when the ground is barely a quarter full. apathy is apparent and I have serious doubts that enough people will be bothered even though they say they care. its one thing to say they care about United. But quite another when you ask if they will get off their backsides and get them to do something. Anything. rather than sit in apathy and watch it disappear.
they were involved with the horrendous debacle at Hereford. i won't go into that one. top much is already documented, at least the council stuck to its guns. and now have the new Hereford FC as tenants. Poole town has supposedly been planned for getting a new home. nothing but a pipe dream. ( my computer decided it was going to replace pipe with oboe. Well would it make any difference. You can dream of oboes as well but either way it won't bring about a new stadium).
One or two have commented on here that we should be concentrating on supporting the team right now. and leave the aggro until later. But I contend to you that it will be too late to leave it to the end of the season. The public have to be told now. it will take an awful lot before it filters down to anyone who might do anything about it. its like driving a car. you have to use your indicators to signal your intent well before you want to turn off. not as you turn off.( sorry if i have burst anyones bubbles who drive cars. I was a highly qualified instructor). You can't start to inform people but it takes time before they cotton on how serious the situation is. leave it to the end of the season and it might be too late before people rise up and start to have a go. assuming they can now in their state of apathy.
As one had put it many years ago. THE ONLY HING NECESSARY FOR THE TRIUMPH OF EVIL IS THAT GOOD MEN DO NOTHING. Dave Thomas please note!. to have a position of influence and not use it to investigate the truth is incomprehensible. it does no one any service to make ribald accusations without proof, but it is incumbent upon people who are in a position of power to let it happen without any complaint at all. further it is incumbent upon those in office to act without impropriety and favour to allow something like this to happen behind the publics back as it seems is happening. it smacks of corruption, not necessarily because they have received any bribes, but just through ignorance and lack of due process. the process itself then becomes corrupt. and asks the question of that official whether he or she is then fit for office.
A very great part of the mischiefs that vex the world arises from words. another quote to bear in mind. Words are cheap. words used to deny people due process are poor and corrupt and words used to deceive are evil.
so bearing this in mind. lets use our words carefully and intelligently and aim them like a modern weapon. guided by laser. i.e. they are able to do real damage to those who aim to deceive. backed up with proof where we can and substantial circumstantial evidence if we cannot. don't aim to just fire off with invective. like Someone from the club has done on the OS. that in itself has served to damage their cause and can be used to bring the whole house of cards down. we ,just avoid the temptation to fire back likewise. threats of bad things, violence or criminal activity would undermine our whole cause. we need to go in at them armed with faith in our cause. Truth backed up by evidence and openness and transparency which shows up the other side for what they are. as would self interest. promoting oneself as the self serving saviour or whatever. some can come on as looking to promote how good they look in public. and as a result, end up undermining the message which turns others right off them and the cause as a result. and lets use our words intelligently. clean language that can be directed in the right quarters and unmask the officials who intend to hurt us. So many times a cause has been undermined by foul mouth rants that have given the imression that we are nothing but the usual brush tarred bunch of foul mouthed thugs this is so apparent on pages of Facebook and some of the forums i have witnessed. yes we may be angry. but to vent that anger out in an uncontrolled spew does us no service at all and those in power will just ignore us and think we are worth burying. The OS has shown than words can damage reputations. they did their cause no good at all when venting their criticism. no matter that the individual concerned has a reputation on here for being less than diplomatic. they used a bludgeon where better use of language would have been more useful. But that serves to help our cause. as long as we learn from it.
Always Look on the bright side of life
Check out my poems topic... http://www.torquayfans.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4843
Check out my poems topic... http://www.torquayfans.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4843
-
Scott Brehaut
- TorquayFans Admin
- Posts: 4556
- Joined: 05 Sep 2010, 16:04
- Favourite player: Lee Mansell
- Location: Guernsey
What in the name of all that is good and holy are you banging on about??Neal wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 12:22 yes they have probably weighed it all up and thought lets go with the winner as they will still want to have some relationship with them.
but you know what also p*sses me off, MANY OF YOU ON HERE!
There was a handful of posters and it was just a few who were anti GI right from the start, before they took over, and the crap and excuses that many of you posted during that time. Now, all on board when its probably too bloody late.
Hope your pleased with yourselves!!
You're blaming a load of posters on the forum for "allowing" GI to take over the club?? Mate, your anger needs to be directed elsewhere, as there is nothing that any of us could have done to prevent that which has already happened. As soon as the old board shook hands with GI in order to get the loan to keep this club going, we were ****. Nothing we could have done about that. There were others offering to buy the club, but the other board were blinkered by GI and Pete Masters, as has been well documented.
Out of interest, given you were so anti them from the start, what have YOU done to exonerate yourself of any "blame"?
STIP
Friend of torquayfans.com
-
Soupdragon
- On the Bench
- Posts: 123
- Joined: 06 Nov 2016, 18:05
- Favourite player: Steve Woods
Ha ha! I don't believe the Herald could be complicit in anything in the Bay! Have you seen the rubbish on their website lately? "Sheep block road in Moretonhampstead." Or some such; who knows? It's generally either trivial or drivel. The circulation's dropping through the floor, and I can't think of a single friend or acquaintance who actually pays hard cash for it now.Southampton Gull wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 08:04 The Herald are definitely complicit in the deal for Plainmoor. Unfortunately my information is GI already have the deal done.
I have sought further information this morning, and have been unequivocally* informed that the mayor - whose decision it is; not any staff/officers - has made NO decision.
I also heard this morning that there was a group of 'council people' at the game yesterday, with popsiders chanting "It's OUR ground" at them. Seems odd: if GI WERE to have entertained any councillors or staff BEFORE any decision was taken, then that rather does leave the council open to accusations of venality. Of course, there are plenty of councillors and officers/staff who are fans and may well have attended together ... Chinese whispers and all that.
The latest word I hear is that GI is now considering sites other than Plainmoor, with the freehold of Plainmoor not necessarily in the frame any longer.
*Edited to add: I have no idea whether I am getting the truth; a version of it; or not. I don't think my 'source' would be lied to, but, hey, nothing would surprise me these days.
Last edited by Soupdragon on 18 Apr 2017, 15:10, edited 1 time in total.
-
Southampton Gull
- TorquayFans Admin
- Posts: 7852
- Joined: 05 Sep 2010, 01:35
- Location: Southampton
I think I can safely say you're not referring to me hereNeal wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 12:22
but you know what also p*sses me off, MANY OF YOU ON HERE!
There was a handful of posters and it was just a few who were anti GI right from the start, before they took over, and the crap and excuses that many of you posted during that time. Now, all on board when its probably too bloody late.
Hope your pleased with yourselves!!
Dave
Friend of TorquayFans.com
Friend of TorquayFans.com
-
SenorDingDong
- First Regular
- Posts: 442
- Joined: 17 Apr 2015, 16:04
- Favourite player: David Graham
It's just what we don't need. Kevin Foster and other local MPs will be very distracted, the Lib Dems on the Council will be more concerned with leading the charge to win back lost seats rather than lead the fight against Plainmoor and if Adrian Sanders stands again, he'll be totally distracted with it.
Meanwhile as this all goes on, GI can continue operating in the shadows and getting closer to their ambition.
-
Southampton Gull
- TorquayFans Admin
- Posts: 7852
- Joined: 05 Sep 2010, 01:35
- Location: Southampton
Soupdragon wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 15:04 Ha ha! I don't believe the Herald could be complicit in anything in the Bay! Have you seen the rubbish on their website lately? "Sheep block road in Moretonhampstead." Or some such; who knows? It's generally either trivial or drivel. The circulation's dropping through the floor, and I can't think of a single friend or acquaintance who actually pays hard cash for it now.
I have sought further information this morning, and have been unequivocally* informed that the mayor - whose decision it is; not any staff/officers - has made NO decision.
I also heard this morning that there was a group of 'council people' at the game yesterday, with popsiders chanting "It's OUR ground" at them. Seems odd: if GI WERE to have entertained any councillors or staff BEFORE any decision was taken, then that rather does leave the council open to accusations of venality. Of course, there are plenty of councillors and officers/staff who are fans and may well have attended together ... Chinese whispers and all that.
The latest word I hear is that GI is now considering sites other than Plainmoor, with the freehold of Plainmoor not necessarily in the frame any longer.
*Edited to add: I have no idea whether I am getting the truth; a version of it; or not. I don't think my 'source' would be lied to, but, hey, nothing would surprise me these days.
On this occasion I would much rather you are correct BUT this is what I was told and being a usually reliable source I've passed it on.
Dave
Friend of TorquayFans.com
Friend of TorquayFans.com
-
SenorDingDong
- First Regular
- Posts: 442
- Joined: 17 Apr 2015, 16:04
- Favourite player: David Graham
How would their business plan even work in that case? - considering they've gone on record stating that they need the Plainmoor freehold to help fund their development at the Willows. Are you suggesting that the Council will sell them land elsewhere to develop in order to fund the new stadium? That seems rather strange given what we know about GI's modus operandi and the problem of getting any deal like that passed in Torbay.Soupdragon wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 15:04 The latest word I hear is that GI is now considering sites other than Plainmoor, with the freehold of Plainmoor not necessarily in the frame any longer.
*Edited to add: I have no idea whether I am getting the truth; a version of it; or not. I don't think my 'source' would be lied to, but, hey, nothing would surprise me these days.
Hahaha I know.Southampton Gull wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 15:10 I think I can safely say you're not referring to me here
Touched a few nerves, which I thought it would do, when the others logon later there will be more.
Done plenty that was in my control.
Contacted every councillor.
Tried tirelessly on here to get more on board EARLY. That failed because you all believed them in various degrees.
Wanted an early boycott, but again no one interested.
My strategy was to put them under pressure early. I dont know if it would have been successful or not, but the lets wait till the end looks like it wont be.
I told you so!!
TUST MEMBER
Which is why your views on GI are ones I put most store by Gloster as you have had direct experience of these lowlifes. Yours and Rob's (rjc70 on here I think) as he was a Reading Racers speedway fan and so has already seen one of his sporting loves ripped away by these venal scumbags.Glostergull wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 14:19 Some of you know I was involved with Bristol Rovers board way back in the early days of GI
And I would have gambled early, with the fallback of a pheonix club as long as we could save plainmoor. Its well documented my views on this, but I was shot down by many on here because they couldnt face the prospect of starting again. But there we are.
TUST MEMBER
Yes, that's me Jerry. Rob on the other two forums.Jerry wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 15:40 Which is why your views on GI are ones I put most store by Gloster as you have had direct experience of these lowlifes. Yours and Rob's (rjc70 on here I think) as he was a Reading Racers speedway fan and so has already seen one of his sporting loves ripped away by these venal scumbags.
-
SenorDingDong
- First Regular
- Posts: 442
- Joined: 17 Apr 2015, 16:04
- Favourite player: David Graham
Indeed. First hand experience with these guys is exactly what is needed in this fight and also provides a lot of legitimacy to the claims that are being made.Jerry wrote: ↑18 Apr 2017, 15:40 Which is why your views on GI are ones I put most store by Gloster as you have had direct experience of these lowlifes. Yours and Rob's (rjc70 on here I think) as he was a Reading Racers speedway fan and so has already seen one of his sporting loves ripped away by these venal scumbags.
-
Yorkieandy
- Top Scorer
- Posts: 1554
- Joined: 07 Apr 2015, 00:05
- Favourite player: Kev Nic
Totally agree with you Neal although it's not the fans fault GI are in control. Even if the trust had more than enough money as generated by the supporters in order to have bought the club out before GI stepped in, it is doubtless those in charge would have accepted the bid.
My annoyance is that fans continue to bother about which league the club will be playing in next season like it matters. It doesn't matter when in a few years time the club doesn't exist.
I don't really do 'i told you so's' but all I can say is that i had a strong feeling the way the club was being run even in the two years before relegation and the total lack of direction or response from those in charge upon relegation just proved to me that nobody running the gaff actually gives a toss nor knows what they're doing.
It was at that moment I stopped going because when you are convinced inside that the club you had been following up and down the land for the previous 8 years won't actually exist in the next 8 years then why would you continue to go?
Plainmoor could have been sold out every home game since relegation and it wouldn't have changed anything one bit. We've been screwed over big time so let the f*ckers have what they want and we can all move on.
The people who want to see a sustainable, democratic and accountable TUFC all together and let us start again from the bottom.
Makes perfect sense to me. The club has gone.
Just my opinion of course. I admire anyone who wants to fight tooth and nail for what they believe in and so I can't criticise. All I can do is say that i don't believe in a future for the club in it's current guise so by the same token have no passion for it anymore.
As I've always said. A phoenix club would receive my money, time, support and dedication and I'd be proud as hell to be brave enough to start again at whatever level.
You think it was bad on here for doubters and abuse try facebook never had so much abuse and ive been engaged twice! but its all out there now might be to late but wnt go down with a wimper wish I suppose is something. and I like the idea of a phoenix club and I think a lot more people are open to the idea than were before.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests
