Alfreton Town v Torquay United – Saturday 11th October 2014

[Sunnysideup]

Would have been a better post if the OP knew that Harding was a midfielder? (though he may have been better suited than Richards)

[Gulliball]

Harding is a central midfielder. Taller than Richards but still no match for their target man striker and coming back from 2 months injured - so no improvement on Richards at all.

Once Ives was away on International Duty, Hutchings had to make his debut. We only had 4 available defenders, so the 'choice' was made for him. You would think that Hargreaves, after Buckle tried the exact same thing with him in 2008/09, would know how unlikely it was to succeed. Maybe he thought he could use his own experience to give Richards enough insight to allow it to come of? Ultimately it failed spectacularly and he should accept the blame for a) doing it, and then b) not changing it.

Hutchings needs to go out on loan now. We have three senior central defenders fighting for two spots, and if he isn't going to play even when two of them are out, then he's never going to play this season. Get him playing first team football as high as possible and give him a chance to develop.

[kevgull]

Very poor decision to play Richards at the back, I feel sorry for the lad, you could see how completely crushed he was when the cameras were focused on him at the end of the game. Nicky Law out smarted our rooky manager in the 1st half, unfortunately CH did not have the balls to change things for the 2nd half and so………… the game was lost.

3 points dropped by the manager, CH needs to front up and admit that he got it wrong and not hide behind the players performances as this may be the catalyst of a bad run should the players start to lose confidence in him. Hutchings would have been gutted not to have been given his chance but probably quietly smirking to himself after the game.
Root cause - No 1st defenders available due to previously poor discipline, backed up by playing a midfield player who was clearly out of his depth at Conference level.
250 mile journey home should have been ample time to pick the bones from this debacle and hopefully move on.

[supergulls]

To put Richards in a center half and for him to have such a stinker was unfortunate, but to not change it at half time when he clearly knew there was a problem is unforgivable. If your going to put Hutchings on the bench you are saying that if called upon he is capable and up to standard to do a job on the pitch, therefore it makes the decision to leave hi there even more crazy. it seems to me that Chris wouldn't make the change as he would then be accepting for everybody to see that he made the wrong choice. Hutchings looked devastated outside the ground as he was boarding the coach. I have watched numerous reserve games last year against league sides where Hutchings has played against some very capable forwards such as Paddy Madden at Yeovil, Jamie Reid, Marvin Morgan etc etc I could go on and the lad has always coped well and looked up to the job. he was always spoken highly off at the club and I cant believe that he has gone backwards maybe its just a case of the managers opinion.
it was only a month ago that it was said that he went up to Southend and apparently did well and impressed the management there in a couple of trial matches.

[tommyg]

I've been away for the weekend but managed to record the game and avoid the result until watching it late last night. Wish I hadn't bothered but at least I could fast-forward parts! I have been full of praise for Hargreaves this season but he completely lost the plot. He talks a good game in front of the cameras but perhaps he was more concerned that his hair and coat looked right for TV instead of focusing on the most inept defensive display I've seen in a long time.

Every Torquay fan said it was a bad idea to play Richards in defence. He's one of our smallest players and doesn't possess the right attributes for a makeshift centre-back. So why did Hargreaves - and to some extent Hodges - not realise this? It's utterly bizarre because it seems our supporters are more informed than our management team which is very worrying. If he doesn't think Hutchings is ready then there's no point of him being here. Richards isn't much older himself and Hargreaves has selected younger players in defence since taking over (Ives and Cargill). I have no idea if Hutchings is any good but he's a member of the squad and was our only other available centre-back. But apparently it makes more sense to play a midfielder ahead of him. Even if you were going down that route, surely Harding would have been a better choice. At least he has the height and physical presence.

But even more concerning than all that is the fact Hargreaves didn't change it during the game. You could tell after 10 minutes that poor Richards was out of his depth. At half-time, Hutchings or Harding should have replaced the anonymous Wakefield with Richards moved into midfield - an area of the team which was also weakened by Hargreaves' strange decision-making. Hargreaves must take full blame for this defeat and the fact he hasn't already shows his stubbornness which he has picked up from Buckle. I know they clashed at the end of Hargreaves' playing spell here and it looks apparent that it was because they are actually quite alike.

But that wasn't Hargreaves' only tactical error. Why did he start with Briscoe wide and Ajala through the middle when that clearly didn't work against Wrexham? Why did he bring Yeoman on as a left winger? Why was Chappell not a sub when we had no cover on the wing but instead two strikers on the bench?

It's quite clear that the weak areas in the team are in goal and at full-back. Tonge was at fault for the third goal and Cruise's reluctance to head the ball gave away the second goal. Rice wasn't directly at fault for any of the goals but he was beaten twice at his near post, dived out of the way of every shot and can't command his area. The problem is Seabright looks even worse based on the very little I've seen. He still deserves a chance though given that Rice has been poor for four games on the trot.

Ives should be in the team ahead of Cruise when he returns from international duty but as Hargreaves hasn't used any of his budget to bring in a right-back it means we're stuck with Tonge, who has been much better this season but still makes mistakes. Downes and MacDonald need to be restored this week. Pearce was hopeless on Saturday and barely won a header against Clayton, who didn't look particularly tall but was obviously a graduate of the Kevin Hill leaping academy. He has been a sub all season for Alfreton but made Pearce look like a Sunday league player.

Richards' confidence has probably been destroyed - it wouldn't surprise me if Hargreaves blamed him for the defeat instead of looking in the mirror. Wakefield adds very little to the team. The game passes him by and he should be sent back to Bournemouth now Harding is fit again. Hopefully Bowman's injury isn't serious although I haven't been impressed by him this season. He could be on double figures but misses far too many chances. Unfortunately, while O'Achie brings a lot to the team, I don't think I would be confident in him scoring an open goal. He seems to panic in shooting positions and shanks a lot of attempts. Briscoe is our best finisher and was the only real positive from Saturday. Ajala did quite well too although needs a new pair of boots. He's so unpredictable. I don't think he even knows what he's going to do half of the time.

Looking at out fixture list, we've got a very difficult run up to the New Year, although given that we have been humiliated by the two worst teams in the division, perhaps that's a good thing!

[Dave]

It's completely wrong to blame Chris Hargreaves for taking the decision to play Richards at centre back, if Richards has a storming game, we're all over this forum referring to CH as a football management genius, it's easy with the benefit of hindsight to call CH an idiot for starting Richards as it went pear shaped , maybe the game being live on TV came into it, maybe CH thought Hutching's might have been overwhelmed, who knows, could have been a bit of favouritism.

Posted it myself, agree with the sentiment posted by supergulls and others, the thing that got my goat, and is irking me, is how obvious was it that Richards wasn't coping at centre back, it was there for all to see, and that's when a manager earns his corn, I personally would have changed it after 30 minutes, yes Harding is a midfielder and Hutchings would have been the right change, but if CH was worried about Hutchings lack of experience, then I wouldn't have argued if he'd brought on Harding, after all, CH said himself on the side lines we weren't coping with the long balls.

[kevgull]

It's completely wrong to blame Chris Hargreaves for taking the decision to play Richards at centre back, if Richards has a storming game, we're all over this forum referring to CH as a football management genius, it's easy with the benefit of hindsight to call CH an idiot for starting Richards as it went pear shaped , maybe the game being live on TV came into it, maybe CH thought Hutching's might have been overwhelmed, who knows, could have been a bit of favouritism.

Posted it myself, agree with the sentiment posted by supergulls and others, the thing that got my goat, and is irking me, is how obvious was it that Richards wasn't coping at centre back, it was there for all to see, and that's when a manager earns his corn, I personally would have changed it after 30 minutes, yes Harding is a midfielder and Hutchings would have been the right change, but if CH was worried about Hutchings lack of experience, then I wouldn't have argued if he'd brought on Harding, after all, CH said himself on the side lines we weren't coping with the long balls.

Why have Hutchings in the 1st team squad and then not use him? If he's on the bench alongside Harding and we were to lose a Centre back during a game, who plays?
I would be very interested to know the level we should be introducing Hutchings in order to give him experience, Conference South on loan?

[Ausgull]

I stand corrected to my previous post , yes Harding is a central midfielder not a defender but I would of been ok with that if Hargreaves brought him on to play the central defender role as he has played alongside Pearce on many occassions and would of been better suited for the role.
The idea to play Richards backfired for all the world to see and to not replace him at half time doesnt make sense.

[Dave]

Why have Hutchings in the 1st team squad and then not use him? If he's on the bench alongside Harding and we were to lose a Centre back during a game, who plays?
I would be very interested to know the level we should be introducing Hutchings in order to give him experience, Conference South on loan?

kev, I agree with you. After all in my post you quoted I did say Hutchings was the right change, and in answer if CH is concerned about his lack of experience, the only place to send him worth while to some, would be to a conference south club.

[Scott Brehaut]

Its actually gopt nothing to do with anyone waiting for the run of victories to end - its actually the way it ended thats the problem.
Losing to Telford was an absolutely appalling result. Rice in that game let in three howlers.
I accept that could be written off as a fluke as you wouldn't normally expect a professional goalkeeper to let in three goals like that.
However to concede another four goals to an equally abject team a fortnight later shows that there are massive problems.
Harping on about travelling on the day is just an excuse in my book. We just didn't apply ourselves at all.
You could see that even the Alfreton manager thought they were going to lose before the game started.

Errr, no - Nicky Law said that they were in a false position and that, in his opinion, the team deserved to be higher up the league. He also said that his strike force would come good eventually as there were definately goals in the team.

Never once did he look like saying that he thought they were going to lose before the game started. I thought he actually looked rather confident and chipper when thinking about where his team are in the league.

[SuperNickyWroe]

bottom line is CH f**ked up.

he and probably hodges thought that we just had to turn up to win.

as others have alluded to, after his sh1t experiment playing - and failing himself at CB, why the f**k would you want to try it as a manager?

its no good harping on about if had worked he would have been called a genius - it didnt so he should take the flak.

FFS he may as well played there himself.

[kevgull]

Arrogant arsehole springs to mind.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/29600281

[tommyg]

It's completely wrong to blame Chris Hargreaves for taking the decision to play Richards at centre back, if Richards has a storming game, we're all over this forum referring to CH as a football management genius, it's easy with the benefit of hindsight to call CH an idiot for starting Richards as it went pear shaped , maybe the game being live on TV came into it, maybe CH thought Hutching's might have been overwhelmed, who knows, could have been a bit of favouritism.

Posted it myself, agree with the sentiment posted by supergulls and others, the thing that got my goat, and is irking me, is how obvious was it that Richards wasn't coping at centre back, it was there for all to see, and that's when a manager earns his corn, I personally would have changed it after 30 minutes, yes Harding is a midfielder and Hutchings would have been the right change, but if CH was worried about Hutchings lack of experience, then I wouldn't have argued if he'd brought on Harding, after all, CH said himself on the side lines we weren't coping with the long balls.

To be fair, as soon as someone on here hinted that Richards was going to play at centre-back there were plenty of disconcerting voices. On paper it looked a terrible idea and that's how it panned out. Nobody was too surprised that Richards had a shocker because he doesn't have the attributes to play in defence - even if it is for one game. We could all see that so why couldn't our management team? If he doesn't fancy Hutchings, then the most sensible option would have been to play Harding back there. Also by moving Richards into defence, Hargreaves weakened our midfield and broke up a partnership which has been excellent this season. Worryingly, based on Hargreaves' post-match comments, he thinks it's the players' fault and hasn't taken any responsibility.

[brucie]

Yes apparently it had nothing to do with us playing the smallest player in our squad at centre back. What a complete and utter joke.
The problem was that moving Richards out of midfield seriously weakened that area of the pitch as Wakefield did precisley feck all in the first half.
Clearly Hargreaves was going to play Cruise at centre half and bring in Ives had he been available.
As that option wasn't on and with Harding not apparently fit enough I agree that he should have played Hutchings at centre half.
Plain fact is that Clayton is decent in the air - so playing your smallest player against him is just complete lunacy.

[Dave]

To be fair, as soon as someone on here hinted that Richards was going to play at centre-back there were plenty of disconcerting voices. On paper it looked a terrible idea and that's how it panned out. Nobody was too surprised that Richards had a shocker because he doesn't have the attributes to play in defence - even if it is for one game. We could all see that so why couldn't our management team? If he doesn't fancy Hutchings, then the most sensible option would have been to play Harding back there. Also by moving Richards into defence, Hargreaves weakened our midfield and broke up a partnership which has been excellent this season. Worryingly, based on Hargreaves' post-match comments, he thinks it's the players' fault and hasn't taken any responsibility.

That's a fair post. Being honest when I saw Richards name at centre back, I had the same thoughts, all I'm saying is us fans held an opinion, that opinion could have been wrong, so I believe we can not critize CH's original decision to put Richards at centre back, and it turns out Richards was pants in that position and the opinion held by most of us fans was right.

But what we can, and heavily critize CH for is not having the guts to change when he should of, and not at least taking some responsibility for it, players make mistakes, so do managers ( no one should be hung for a mistake) my message to CH would be, it doesn't hurt to put your hands up and say I got it wrong.