Gary Owers

[Gulliball]

Please enlighten me with the dross Nicholson inherited from Knill & Hargreaves because I'm pretty sure he inherited Paul Cox's squad ?

The squad Nicholson picked up from Paul Cox, following the 7-3 defeat against Bromley had three players that went on to play any part in our survival (MacDonald, Smith and Butler). The other eight starters were Lavercombe, Hurst, Geohaghon, Fenwick, Marsh, Carmichael, Briscoe & Lavelle-Moore - possibly two of which in Hurst and Marsh had some talent but wanted away, an eighteen year old Lavercombe in goal with potential but right at the start of his career, but the rest needed to be cleared out. The rest of the squad was the same (Heslop, Bell, Quigley, Murombedzi...).

The last line-up before Owers took over (also a defeat against Bromley) contained Dorel, McGinty, Young, Higgins, Efete, Dowling, Reid, as well as Gray, Pittman, Keating, Anderson. I think most people would rate this season's squad as far better than that which began 2015/16 - which is the basis of the now famous "lottery winning" comments from Nicholson after his departure.

Inheriting 27 players is also a bit misleading, given how many were non-contract and one month loans. For the defeat at Woking under Herrea we had 10 contracted players to fill 10 outfield positions, and everyone else was injured, on loan or non-contract. 5 strikers were forced into the starting 11 in a 4-2-4 formation because there was literally no-one else to play.

I sympathise with any Torquay manager over the last few seasons, given the off-field issues they've had to work with, but Owers has had a comparatively good situation to inherit in that he had time to assess the squad, get rid of any loanees/non-contract players he didn't want and then form a side of his own. Considering that there were a number of good players in the squad when he arrived, and the backing he's been given to sign 12 players, going from 8 points adrift of safety to 11 points adrift in his 4 months in charge is underwhelming to date.

One of the biggest problems is that 9 of the 13 players to feature last weekend were players he inherited. The other 4 (O'Sullivan, Balatoni, Fletcher and Mitchell) are all recent signings, so too early to judge - but all previous players Owers has brought in are yet to make any impact - which is a polar opposite to the additions Nicholson made in 2015/16.

[SuperNickyWroe]

The squad Nicholson picked up from Paul Cox, following the 7-3 defeat against Bromley had three players that went on to play any part in our survival (MacDonald, Smith and Butler). The other eight starters were Lavercombe, Hurst, Geohaghon, Fenwick, Marsh, Carmichael, Briscoe & Lavelle-Moore - possibly two of which in Hurst and Marsh had some talent but wanted away, an eighteen year old Lavercombe in goal with potential but right at the start of his career, but the rest needed to be cleared out. The rest of the squad was the same (Heslop, Bell, Quigley, Murombedzi...).

The last line-up before Owers took over (also a defeat against Bromley) contained Dorel, McGinty, Young, Higgins, Efete, Dowling, Reid, as well as Gray, Pittman, Keating, Anderson. I think most people would rate this season's squad as far better than that which began 2015/16 - which is the basis of the now famous "lottery winning" comments from Nicholson after his departure.

Inheriting 27 players is also a bit misleading, given how many were non-contract and one month loans. For the defeat at Woking under Herrea we had 10 contracted players to fill 10 outfield positions, and everyone else was injured, on loan or non-contract. 5 strikers were forced into the starting 11 in a 4-2-4 formation because there was literally no-one else to play.

I sympathise with any Torquay manager over the last few seasons, given the off-field issues they've had to work with, but Owers has had a comparatively good situation to inherit in that he had time to assess the squad, get rid of any loanees/non-contract players he didn't want and then form a side of his own. Considering that there were a number of good players in the squad when he arrived, and the backing he's been given to sign 12 players, going from 8 points adrift of safety to 11 points adrift in his 4 months in charge is underwhelming to date.

One of the biggest problems is that 9 of the 13 players to feature last weekend were players he inherited. The other 4 (O'Sullivan, Balatoni, Fletcher and Mitchell) are all recent signings, so too early to judge - but all previous players Owers has brought in are yet to make any impact - which is a polar opposite to the additions Nicholson made in 2015/16.

Chris, you never ever fail to amaze me with your stats....

[lucy6lucy]

The squad Nicholson picked up from Paul Cox, following the 7-3 defeat against Bromley had three players that went on to play any part in our survival (MacDonald, Smith and Butler). The other eight starters were Lavercombe, Hurst, Geohaghon, Fenwick, Marsh, Carmichael, Briscoe & Lavelle-Moore - possibly two of which in Hurst and Marsh had some talent but wanted away, an eighteen year old Lavercombe in goal with potential but right at the start of his career, but the rest needed to be cleared out. The rest of the squad was the same (Heslop, Bell, Quigley, Murombedzi...).

The last line-up before Owers took over (also a defeat against Bromley) contained Dorel, McGinty, Young, Higgins, Efete, Dowling, Reid, as well as Gray, Pittman, Keating, Anderson. I think most people would rate this season's squad as far better than that which began 2015/16 - which is the basis of the now famous "lottery winning" comments from Nicholson after his departure.

Inheriting 27 players is also a bit misleading, given how many were non-contract and one month loans. For the defeat at Woking under Herrea we had 10 contracted players to fill 10 outfield positions, and everyone else was injured, on loan or non-contract. 5 strikers were forced into the starting 11 in a 4-2-4 formation because there was literally no-one else to play.

I sympathise with any Torquay manager over the last few seasons, given the off-field issues they've had to work with, but Owers has had a comparatively good situation to inherit in that he had time to assess the squad, get rid of any loanees/non-contract players he didn't want and then form a side of his own. Considering that there were a number of good players in the squad when he arrived, and the backing he's been given to sign 12 players, going from 8 points adrift of safety to 11 points adrift in his 4 months in charge is underwhelming to date.

One of the biggest problems is that 9 of the 13 players to feature last weekend were players he inherited. The other 4 (O'Sullivan, Balatoni, Fletcher and Mitchell) are all recent signings, so too early to judge - but all previous players Owers has brought in are yet to make any impact - which is a polar opposite to the additions Nicholson made in 2015/16.

Nicholson was a novice as manager, but had basic standards to succeed . He Had yellow blood. He worked miracles in his time under GI and now under Clarke Osborne. Nicholson was left with no funds after January last year, he engaged and motivated the squad to somehow escape relegation( which probably pissed Geoff harrop big style). Owers it seems has been given an open cheque book, in that he has been able to add sufficiently. But hasn't the club at heart. Massive difference. And that reflects in the dismal performances of late.

This club has massive potential to an owner with correct morales

[Gulliball]

One other stat from players used this season was that 21 different players got on the pitch in the 2 cup games we played this season - which given the relatively short time between them seems pretty incredible. That, probably more than anything else, summarises where we've gone wrong this season - and when the obituaries get written in April it will be letting Nicholson build a squad, sacking him after 4 games, letting caretakers have 6 games in charge and make their own signings, then bringing in Owers to make his own, that must take centre-stage. It's not even something that you need hindsight to see, but either Nicholson should have been sacked last April or he should have been backed to build and manage his side this season. We've ended up paying him off and then backing the new manager, just to end up with a disjointed and ever-changing squad.

We've already used 35 players this season, which doesn't yet include the last signing [s]Ashley[/s] Aaron! Barnes, and given what we face to survive, there will surely be many more to come as well beyond that.

[lucy6lucy]

One other stat from players used this season was that 21 different players got on the pitch in the 2 cup games we played this season - which given the relatively short time between them seems pretty incredible. That, probably more than anything else, summarises where we've gone wrong this season - and when the obituaries get written in April it will be letting Nicholson build a squad, sacking him after 4 games, letting caretakers have 6 games in charge and make their own signings, then bringing in Owers to make his own, that must take centre-stage. It's not even something that you need hindsight to see, but either Nicholson should have been sacked last April or he should have been backed to build and manage his side this season. We've ended up paying him off and then backing the new manager, just to end up with a disjointed and ever-changing squad.

We've already used 35 players this season, which doesn't yet include the last signing Ashley Barnes, and given what we face to survive, there will surely be many more to come as well beyond that.

I agree the club*should have sacked or backed Nicholson after the north ferriby match. To allow him build a squad and sack him after four games is unforgivable.

*club being harrop

Owers is either mentally insane or just following the brief laid out by harrop. Osborne his beloved brother in law, is just spending to speculate. Either way if I was Osborne I would be sacking harrop as he has quite clearly **** up royal. Wasn't this supposed to be a five year plan.

[Southampton Gull]

They're ahead of schedule

[Jack]

I have very little time for people who don't sell themselves but instead rubbish others and blame everything and everybody for the position they find themselves in. Gary Owers seems to be like this which is why he has failed so spectacularly.
If he could get his act together and at least show some enthusiasm and a more positive charismatic approach he might find that some decent players would take a chance by joining us and some current players might up their game.

[Dockers Pal]

Spot on Gulliball.
Nicho 's failing or bad luck last August was Gowling Davis and Lee not being available for most of those 4 games and having to make do with the cover players who didn't measure up. And also remember that it was Herrera who brought in Efete, Dowling, and Dorel who've all been assets when fit.

BTW I wish it was Ashley Barnes who'd just joined us.

[tomogull]

Ok, ok, we get it, you don’t like Merse. Your crusade to pull apart almost every post he writes is, frankly, boring. Can you not just move on?

Okay - maybe fair comment, Scott. But in the same vein, why not suggest to the Font of All Knowledge that he ceases his, frankly boring, constant 'digs' at Kevin Nicholson, and some of the current squad, and just move on?

[Arrywithnobrain]

Ok, ok, we get it, you don’t like Merse.

Your crusade to pull apart almost every post he writes is, frankly, boring. Can you not just move on?

If you read all the threads and all my posts carefully - maybe a little difficult I know - you will realise that I do not pull apart almost every post that Merse makes: indeed I actually find that on some subjects some of the things that he says are quite informative and balanced. However, when he presents ill informed judgements as though they have been handed down by Solomon, then I am happy to comment thereon. I do not dislike Merse but neither am I one of those unthinking, easily bored sycophants who are either intimidated by or in awe of him. Just as Merse is entitled to sound off as he pleases then I am equally entitled to respond to what I choose. Don't read my posts if you don't like them or if you don't agree with them - I honestly won't be offended by anything that you do or don't do but I would certainly respect any opinions that you wish to express if they are factual and cogently reasoned (which is not something that Merse is prepared to do).

[MellowYellow]

So were all agreed then - bring back Nicho

[Southampton Gull]

So were all agreed then - bring back Nicho

[greb46]

Seems bizarre to me that Nicholson on two occasions performs minor miracles and I did think this season given time he would get the club ending the season mid table and a few games in thrown out the door,poor management which has continued to the present position.

[desperado]

Great stats Gulliball, the key one being 35 players used , so far ! Must be a record. About 20 too many for
a successful side. Owers will have the chance to get it right from the start next season, Nicholson had 4 games,
I would give Owers a dozen, if we are not in the top 6, replace him

[desperado]

I meant 15 too many, its a bit early for me