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I suppose i reluctantly have to accept that you are right Steve. For all my procrastinating over team performances so far this season even i cannot fail to give the club immense credit for some sterling work behind the scenes and some giant strides forward in making sure the existence, sustainability and future of the club is preserved for all of us.

I am short sighted and i am impatient and upon reading back some of my posts this season, especially immediatley after games i have to say that i am a little embarrassed and a lot ashamed of myself given the overall picture. I analyse things to the very death and make 2 and 2 equal 48, especially on this topic regarding Lings comments. I'm not a big fan of the bloke from a management perspective purely because his outlook is so defensive but he is only doing what he feels necessary to keep the club away from relegation and my sniping at his press releases are perhaps unjustified.

We have a well run club with the youth set up being successful, the new Bristows Bench, the new online ticketing system, the more interactive approach with fans like the shirt vote and so forth so there is a lot to be happy about. Having only been a Torquay fan for about 7 years i could possibly try and justify my arguments for lack of ambition by the fact that i have been spoiled. We have had 2 promotions and got to 4 play offs (2 finals) and the other seasons we have been either relegated or the first season under Bucks back in the league everyone was just glad to stay up. So you see i have never really seen a season where there is nothing much to play for and apparently before i began supporting Torquay THAT was the order of the day most seasons. So i suppose i need to get used to being mediocre and just thankful that we don't get into a relegation battle. This season is different though as i believe we have a squad that is more than capable of pushing for a play off spot and so below mid table would represent underachievement in some regards IMO but relative success for some of you because we have stayed up.

I feel Ling is doing a superb job after all he has to cope with the loss of key players and replace them and hope the ones he has brought in remain competetive and by and large he has done this really well on a shoestring budget. Like most managers he has a few blind spots and prone to some infuriating decisions that do continue and continue when it is obvious the decision is an unsatisfactory one and perhaps he persists with something as he has a belief that the decision will be vindicated, however, often he doesn't appear to be willing to examine these decisions to accommodate change.

But all in all i remain positive generally that for stability and structure we have the right man, for a crack at a place in league 1 i can't be so sure.

We do agree though Andy and that is that performances on the pitch have not been good enough. There's no doubt about it. I think if our whole squad is fit we'd have a 'shout' (not a dead cert) of a play-off place. But our whole squad isn't fit and players that need to at least be playing 'average' in order to give us a shot of play-offs just haven't been close to their normal form. That said, last season we were tepid before Christmas but improved after the break. I hope that with a few faces back from injury and maybe a loan signing it can galvanise the squad to try and kick on away from the relegation fight and at least start looking at the play off places.

The only reason I'm not throwing a tantrum after every game is because we aren't in that much short-term trouble. We're not close to the drop (yet!). I'd imagine when the board sets out targets for Ling for the season they are probably fairly unambitious from the view of the fanbase. The meeting would probably consist of the board telling Ling they don't want to get relegated and to be honest I can't see Ling getting the sack unless we are right down there for a long period of time or unless he 'loses the dressing-room' (incredible how that phrase ever came into existance).

Longer term though, the board appear to be looking up; and I can only applaud that.

All good stuff Steve. I hope we can go on a run now but these postponements aren't helping us as we can't get a consistent run of games together. Also do you think Ling could ever get the sack if say, we were mid to below mid table but putting in some real horror shows in terms of performances and attendances fell alarmingly? Could this happen and has it ever happened with any other manager here i wonder?

austrianandygull wrote:All good stuff Steve. I hope we can go on a run now but these postponements aren't helping us as we can't get a consistent run of games together. Also do you think Ling could ever get the sack if say, we were mid to below mid table but putting in some real horror shows in terms of performances and attendances fell alarmingly? Could this happen and has it ever happened with any other manager here i wonder?

I was thinking as I wrote that comment that maybe the fans could have a say in displacing any manager. If the atmosphere became toxic at Plainmoor (much like it did with Steve Kean at Blackburn) I can't see our board being able to stick with a manager that had so obviously lost the majority of Torquay support.

For what it's worth I can't see the crowd at Plainmoor turning too harshly on Ling, even considering the poor run we've been on of late. I'd say there are a few 'boo boys' whenever we lose but it's when a manager emerges from the tunnel and the crowd boos is when you have to worry! Most fans are clever enough to know we can't be near the top of the league every season! Our squad will always be fairly slim and so we remain at the whim of chance and dodgy knees!

Falling attendances would always make a boardroom's alarm bells start ringing. We have fairly poor attendance anyway so it's important to try and keep the 'die hards' happy!

I know you said that most fans know we can't be challenging for promotion or even play offs maybe most of the time but i meant if they knew this and as well as having to watch a side with not much to play for, the performances were like our away ones this season every week and would lots of fans stop going? I accept we might not get in the play offs this season but i don't see why we should also be 'treated' to horrible football most weeks and that is the scenario i was painting with what i said. Would fans be happy paying £17 a pop knowing that Torquay weren't really going anyway but the footy was abysmal most games?

I haven't watched us away from home this season so I'll take your word as I've only got the very limited knowledge from highlights!

I think we're in a transition phase with performances for all this season basically. The spine of the team has been ripped out and in all honesty Ling is probably trying to patch us through to a stage where he can call in some of his own reinforcements and trim off some of the players he doesn't want. This summer will be very important for how our squad shapes up.

Ling will probably try to deliver more entertaining football when he thinks the squad is up to it. I'm not going to try and say that our away performances have been encouraging the fan base to go on more Torquay away days but part of what being a fan is about is sticking with a club through the sticky spells. (I know that sounds incredibly hypocrtical considering I haven't travelled to an away game this season!) Hopefully the defensive performances playing away from home will make way for fast-flowing end-to-end football in the coming months for your trips though Andy!

WILL TRY AGAIN, IN CASE BRUCIE MISSED THIS THE FIRST TIME....I posted this after the Exeter game, and you can see it on page three as well....

Brucie,

You and I often disagree, however I have a genuine question.
You say that you have no confidence in the manager, yet last night in the first half we outplayed a team in third position in the league.
We drew against a team that almost everybody predicted we would lose to by a considerable amount of goals - in fact you even told us on here that you were not going to go as you were certain that we were going to get hammered.
My question - given that we played well against Burton, albeit we lost (even Andy thought we were excellent!!), and also taking into account we got one point more than most people thought we were going to get last night, can you not see that we may, slowly, have started to turn a corner? That Ling may, finally, be getting the team to do what he is asking them to do?