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yellowman wrote:how do you know sam that they dont impress in training , are you there or are you CH

It's about producing on a match day and not a training day, isn't it?

kevgull wrote:
It's about producing on a match day and not a training day, isn't it?

If a player doesn't put in the effort/perform in training, they don't get the match day chance..

George Best used to turn up to training still pissed and in his clothes from the night before (to be honest, he used to turn up on match days in much the same state).

Matt.

I hope that the rationale behind transfer listing these particular players is:
1) CH is sure he can sign replacements who are better or
2) They are too expensive for the club to keep or
3) There are too many players in the squad for these players positions and these are the weakest or
4) something in their attitude, personality, WHY that means CH doesn't want them in the squad
Or a combination of all of them

ferrarilover wrote:George Best used to turn up to training still pissed and in his clothes from the night before (to be honest, he used to turn up on match days in much the same state).

Matt.

Of course, George Best and Jordan Chapell are comparable

Have heard from coaches for a while now that Chappell just doesn't want to be here, was one of the reasons that Ch hasn't played him. Downers is due to wage constraints, and I'd keep Benyon all day long. Not too much quality, but he will work his ass off for the club. One of the few who genuinely wants to play for TUFC

brooker wrote:Have heard from coaches for a while now that Chappell just doesn't want to be here, was one of the reasons that Ch hasn't played him. Downers is due to wage constraints, and I'd keep Benyon all day long. Not too much quality, but he will work his ass off for the club. One of the few who genuinely wants to play for TUFC

That does explain a few things and Chapell is easily league quality and downes well he could get in the league as well

Whilst you could quite easily argue a case for every single one of them being released, you do think that one or two, whilst not good enough at League 2 perhaps may just have been able to do a job in the Conference. No doubt that probably one or two still will as it's surely unlikely that they will all get fixed up elsewhere, but whether it turns out to be the ones you want to keep remains to be seen!

The numbers involved (6) does potentially seriously hamper Greavsie's recruitment drive this summer though as whilst some may get fixed up elsewhere early on there is in reality no rush for any of these players to jump at the first offer that comes along as they are safe in the knowledge that whatever happens, they still have a year on their contract down here.

That will potentially limit how much CH can do to bring replacements in as it is most likely that these players are taking up a fair chunk of next year's budget and so he will have to be very patient whilst at the same time hoping that players he wants to sign don't move on rather than waiting for us. It was so much easier for Paul Buckle in that first year in the Conference when he only had three players under contract ... all of whom he was happy to retain.

Dockers Pal wrote:I hope rationale behind transfer listing these particular players is:
1) CH is sure he can sign replacements who are better or
2) They are too expensive for the club to keep or
3) There are too many players in the squad for these players positions and these are the weakest or
4) something in their attitude, personality, WHY that means CH doesn't want them in the squad
Or a combination of all of them

What other options are there? This isn't primary school, Jesus isn't getting rid of the kids with the wrong brand of trainers.

Retained lists for relegated clubs are about value. Is the bloke we currently have the best value player I can get in terms of salary, ability, transfer value depreciation (or appreciation, in some cases)? If yes, they stay. If not, they go and are replaced.

Three of the lads listed are likely to be on more than a thousand pounds a week with one other close behind. We lose Chaps and promote Tommo - massive profit over the year. Among those not mentioned already we've lost Nico and perhaps gained Arthur Scargill, a doubling of quality for a halving of salary and an infinite increase in transfer potential.
With Downer, it's likely to be that we can get someone 4/5 as good for 3/5 the money as well as a modest transfer fee. Of all of them, I reckon he was the closest to making the grade. Maybe if he agreed to a substantial pay cut he could remain? I don't think this is the right thing for him to do, but it depends how badly he wants to be here.
I don't know if we've been paying Cooper all that much. He was a free agent, and I just wonder if he was on some sort of pay-as-y'-play affair.
Bah, it's all just guesswork really, but I presume there sound reasoning behind it.

Matt.

You have to assume that Cooper has triggered the option to extend his contract by another 12 months which is a bit cheeky considering he hasn't kicked a ball for us but he's perfectly entitled to do that. Surely, though, the club should have inserted their own clause, where we had the option of stopping him from doing this - especially as we knew there was a strong possibility of being relegated.

Hector - you have an inbred hatred of Benyon (who was incidentally in hospital yesterday). I will concede that he was very disappointing this season. It may have been that he had his best period with us when he was playing alongside players such as Zebroski who are infinity better than we we have now. The same arguement of course may apply to Stevens.
Benyons career stalled after he left here - but maybe there were resons for that.
Clearly Hargreaves cannot get rid of every player he has on the books so I would say that Benyon potentially still has the capacity to score goals in the Conference and trouble defenders at that level. I wouldn't apply the same to HAwley and Stevens who are past their sell by date.
As for Cooper - well he hasn't managed to set foot on the pitch since he has been here and now apparently can take up the option of being paid by us for another twelve months. Words fail me,

For whatever reason Hargreaves doesn't rate Downes as he hasn't played him. Its no secret that Hargreaves seems to prefer quick/pacy and mobile players so that may be why he doesn't favour Downes.

I agree with most of the transfer listings, although I would have liked to see Chappell stay but there must be reasons behind that. Pearce has established himself as our 1st choice CB, and as brucie said it's probably because Hargreaves prefers younger and more energetic players. It will be interesting to see who he offers contracts to now with a number of players I would like to see stay running out of contract this season. I would like to see Rice, Lathrope, Thompson and Yeoman retained. Ricey is our no. 1 goalkeeper and presumably not on the biggest wage so Ricey as no. 1 and a cheap reserve is the most likely and affordable option. I think Lathrope is a proven holding CM and will comfortably do the job in the conference. As for Thompson, we all know he has bags of potential and if Chappell leaves he will act as a cheaper option on the flank. Getting strikers (GOALSCORERS) to play for Torquay at conference level may be a problem, so I see Yeoman as a good striker to have in the squad at least.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if NO players are offered new deals and the 6 are sold, our squad will be left at:

Hutchings
Pearce
Cameron
Harding
Sullivan
Benyon
Chaney
Parcell
(not sure on Labadie/Stevens contracts)

This shows the direction in the squad Hargreave wants, and I'm all for having a young, energetic side IF we had a solid core of experience and leadership.

tommyg wrote:You have to assume that Cooper has triggered the option to extend his contract by another 12 months which is a bit cheeky considering he hasn't kicked a ball for us but he's perfectly entitled to do that. Surely, though, the club should have inserted their own clause, where we had the option of stopping him from doing this - especially as we knew there was a strong possibility of being relegated.

Or maybe there's an option where the club are smart, rather than stupid...?

Just read that Kevin Nicholson's been released. He's been a good player for the club for several years but I think it's the right move, he was past his best.